Error message here!

Hide Error message here!

Forgot your password?

Error message here!

Error message here!

Lost your password? Please enter your email address. You will receive a link to create a new password.

Error message here!

Back to log-in

Close
Sign in to set favorite

Easily clearing a spent Terpenator Column with gusto!

Whoop, whoop, awhoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 1

All ya'll Terpenator owners out there are going to love this!  Check out how easily a column is emptied with just the flick of an air valve!

Column purger-1-1Air discharge-1-1

About The Author

Profile photo of skunkpharmresearch

This is the head cheese's account

Related posts

0 Comments

  1. tylerdurden71

    for the guy who experienced high temps... your system is clogged at that spot and the heat is a result of pressure building up. probably because the butane can't get past that blockage. immediately dump your column and reclaim so that you can fix the issue

    Reply
  2. Lk

    Is it possible to run the mk III with a 2" column with a 1.5x2" reducer on both ends? Or, would I need a 10"x10" collection tank on the bottom to compensate for the extra volume?

    Reply
      1. Kyle Moretti

        Would a 12"W x 24"L recovery tank/storage tank be fine for a material tube of 48"x36" ? and still be fine for liquid butane in the tank with no aspiration issues?

        Reply
          1. Chrispi

            Question. Building a bigger Version. i would like to run 6 inch tubing that is 36" in length. how big of a recover vessel will i need?

            Reply
            1. skunkpharmresearch

              Assuming it is sanitary tubing and is 6" OD, a 36" length would hold about 935 cubic inches. I like to keep at least 6" between the bubbling pool and the pump intake, so if it was a 12" OD lower tank, it would have to be about 15" tall.

  3. wcscoop coop

    Hi, Apologies if this has been covered (and it probably has and I just haven't found it...) Is it necessarry to have the column completely filled with dry material? Or can it be safely operated partially filled? Our cooperative does 20+ varities- some just as trials or on the request of patient members with specific needs, and we would prefer to keep all extractions single varietal rather then potentially having to mix to fill the column completely, or, more to the point, having to build at least two different size tubes to maximixe the machines usefulness.

    Reply
      1. tylerdurden71

        i've run half tubes and just used two sets of 4 10-12 cup filters crumpled up and packed well onto the top of the material. the filters will move, but you shouldn't get any material past them.

        Reply
  4. Classico

    Good evening, a friend of mine said he filters his n-butane through activated carbon, however upon trying this after packing the column with the carbon we got no noticeable flow. Then we took off the top end cap and discovered some sort of reaction had taken place, with the upper column becoming very hot. Can you both tell me whether filtering the butane is a good idea, and possibly explain why the heck it got so hot?

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      Not sure what kind of carbon you used, but coarse prills work better than a finer grind. Not sure where the heat would come from. Nothing in the activated charcoal, or that showed up on the butane analysis, that would appear to cause that reaction. Sounds like a missing third piece of information. We haven't tried post fractional distillation filtration with charcoal yet, and are leaning toward bentonite clay, zeolite, or ditomaceous earth for final polishing.

      Reply
  5. David

    Hello GW, Let me just say wow, you do/know so much I'm blown away by the level of information you and your associates have made available. That being said I'm having a bit of a hard time consuming all of the information and retaining only the most recent/relevant information. As I read through your comments I see people talking about finding parts here and there, and about how Glacier Tanks now carries some parts they did not. I tried putting together a shopping cart following the latest of the parts lists you've made available but some of the parts just are not listed, either by part number or by searching through the inventory for the correct part. Also a lot of the parts are not in stock. For example the 12" and 24" spool for the column and the 6" spool for the tank. I realize it is a lot to ask but would you by any stretch of chance be able to make a new parts list? I'm sure I'm not the only one who would benefit from this. I would like to make an MKIIIa with a sight glass and I currently have none of the required parts. Normally I would study the material more and try to pull my way though but I currently have about 10 lbs. of trim that is ready to run. I need to process it asap. I completely understand if that is out of the realm of your ability at this time but I thought I'd try. As things are I am already in your debt for all of the information you've made available for everyone. Thanks, David

    Reply
      1. David

        Thank you so much GW, Will it be posted here? I ask because I don't believe their website is finished yet. I'm sure the community would appreciate it being made available here, but would I be better off emailing them to get it sooner? I am hoping to assemble one as soon as I can as you know ;) or am I on my time crunch still better off trying to figure out the missing pieces on my own? I and the community thank you, David

        Reply
        1. Beau Paul

          I too was having a hard time locating these parts, as Glacier Tank seems to be out of everything we need! Found this place thanks to Father Earth, looks like they got the goods :) I just ordered a bunch of extra tubes for my MkIIIA http://www.brewershardware.com/Extension-Tubes/

          Reply
          1. skunkpharmresearch

            Good site! Kudos to Father Earth! That is where we originally got the screened gaskets, before Glacier Tank agreed to stock them for us. They don't have the selection that Glacier does, but are one of the places we go for items that they do stock, when Glacier Tank is out.

            Reply
          2. David

            Yeah it looks like they have a lot of the parts we will be needing, some cheaper than glacier tanks, I've sent GW a list I believe has sourced about 99% of the parts we need so hopefully we get something official put up soon. Can't thank you guys enough.

            Reply
          3. david

            I've been in contact with brewers hardware, apparently they have a ship full of the parts we need awaiting x-ray due to customs being shut down as a result of the government shutdown so no idea when their shipment will actually come in. Also it looks like glacier tank does not have the welded on bottoms in stock anymore either and I haven't been able to find a source of 6" spool shorter than 3'. I have placed an order with brewers hardware for the 6" end caps but as it is held up I could maybe order 8" caps and try to get some 8" spool from glacier tanks, Is there anything I would need to worry about when changing the diameter of my collection vessel? And out of curiosity why would the Viton seals be required around the sight glass while only the PTFE are required on the rest of the column, don't they all use the same triclamp/triclover fittings? Wouldn't they all be exposed to the same amount of pressure? Would you be able to explain the need for the upper end rebuild kit? Or link to something that would explain it for me? Would you not recommend a used tank due to contamination issues or because of safety? And lastly while looking over that list was there anything you noticed that I missed or anything else I will need besides butane? thank you for your immense help in this, David

            Reply
            1. skunkpharmresearch

              The 8" spool would give you more surface area, so it would be faster with the same size column and have more capacity for larger columns. It will also take longer to recover, using the same size pump. We use Viton on all of our seals, because PTFE takes too much pressure to reliably seal. I suggest Century Tool for parts: 1-866-277-0888 http://www.centurytool.net/ I don't want to eat out of something that was used for lawrd knows what, so I always get a new nitrogen filled tank. Hoses, valves, fittings, PTFE gas line tape. We like JB Kobra hoses for the purpose and Paramount Supply for the plumbing stuff.

          4. david

            I've found a single 6" x 12" spool, would it be possible to just leave it its 12" length without complication? Would it just make collecting the oil out of the bottom more difficult?

            Reply
          5. david

            Hey GW, I'm starting to get my parts in the mail! Its exciting putting it all together. I've made a mistake though. I ordered the 36" column and a sight glass but made the oversight of only ordering 4' of SS tubing for the vent tube from paramount supply. When I went to order a longer piece they said they would only be shipping them in 4' pieces and charging $31.00 shipping for my $7.00 order. I don't think I will be ordering my vent tube from them. I've been looking around at other options. It seems I can source 304 SS tubing especially welded in loo of seamless pretty cheaply. My question is would it matter if my vent tube was 304 or welded or do I need to find a 316 seamless tube? I'm also looking at flex hoses as I'd like to have the flexibility to use various sized columns but they are very pricey. What would you recommend? Also I did order a 12" x 6" spool for my collection vessel. I'm about to send the lid parts out for fabrication. Are there any modifications I might want to make so that it is more conducive to my taller spool or should I just follow your diagrams? Thanks for all your help along the way, David

            Reply
    1. tylerdurden71

      sadly glacier is out of stock till the next container comes in about 3+ weeks and most of that is already sold out too. if you don't order from glacier now, you don't get on the waiting list, and the waiting list is long already and they get first dibs. paramount has in stock for all their stuff. because waiting a month or two for parts probably isn't in the cards, i'd look at brewery websites. they sometimes call their tri clamp parts tri clover and they are interchangeable. the part number for the sight glass gasket upgrade is sgp-100-viton

      Reply       Edit
      1. David

        Awesome thank you, would I still want the 24" column with the sight glass? It seems like it might be easier to get my hands on pieces that are either longer or shorter for the column and collection tank, would I need to worry about changing any of these dimensions if I wen't changing the diameter of anything? Thanks, David

        Reply
        1. David

          Do you have an email address I could talk to you though? I have sourced what I believe is all you need from current sources. Would you be willing to look it over or have SF look it over to let me know if I've got it all right or am missing anything? I would post it here but I'm not sure the comments is the best place for it due to length and formatting.

          Reply
        2. skunkpharmresearch

          You can use up to a 1 1/2" X 36" column on the Mk IIIA and still have capacity for a 6" sight glass. Make sure the sight glass that you use has seals compatible with butane and is rated for at least 120 psi.

          Reply
  6. Austin from Austin

    Hi GW, I got all the parts ordered for my MK III build. However there is just one thing I can't seem to find. Maybe I'm doing it wrong. The Just Better compound gauge I found has a 1/8" NPT male connector. Where can I find the type of adapter to go from a 1/8" male NPT to R12 Male (3/8")? This way I can connect the R12 charging hose to the Compound Gauge. This seems pretty trivial, however I'm falling flat on my face trying to locate this connector. Much appreciated bud! :)

    Reply
      1. Guthrie

        GW, RSD asked if I was a contractor with a CFC license when I asked about the charging hose in Portland and recommended Harbor Freight when I told them I did not have the license. Is there anywhere to purchase it online or with another vendor?

        Reply
      2. r0kud

        Thanks for the info GW. After looking around I realized that this part can be found at just about any plumbing & home improvement store. Durr *facepalm* To connect the Just Better 1/8" compound gauge to the 3/8" hose, you will need two fittings: -3/8" MIP x 1/8" FIP (Watts P/N: LFA-776) -3/8" FL x 3/8" FIP (Watts P/N: LFA-176)

        Reply
      1. A6 Grower

        How would the be hooked up?? The out from the first machine to the in on the second then to the recovery tank?? Faster recovery times make me happy, the appion megaflow 1/2" is awesome BTW speed up my recovery time a little bit, and the seals are nicer, also replaceable, replaceable seals make me happy also lol. I go through those way to much

        Reply
  7. drymouth

    Jus finished my first run today was kinda nerves but I think everything went all right. ... I Had uh few mistakes 1) I didn't put my lp5 tank in ice while I was running my first cycle an the tank got a little warm! 2) I'm not sure if I ran enough butane through the column? It say's "to repeat steps 8&9 for as many cycles as you want typically 3-5 with the mk III"am I suppose to wait for the sudden chill at the top of the vent 3-5 time s or do I wait for the sudden chill at the top of the vent 1 time, close valve 2&4 wait till the gauge reads 10hg then open valve 2-4 again and wait again for the sudden chill at the top of the vent line for the same second s it took the first time. Am I suppose to do that 3-5 Times or am I suppose to dump the column each time I flood the column?I'm not sure that made sense let more rephrase that, when I open valves 2-4 an Flood the column am I suppose to dump that into the recovery pot, then start over an flood the column again? I would think you have to cuz wouldn't the column over flood? Oh an my return was minimal. ... they may have something to do with the material I use tho? It came out dark with a dark green color.

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      You will only feel the chill the first time. If you timed how long it took for the butane to flow through the column, then you flood the column for that many minutes on the subsequent floods. The butane flows up through the column and out the top vent, then down to the collection tank on all but the last flood. After the last flood, when the pressure drops to 0 psi, open the vent and then the dump valve, so that the column drains the last time in the opposite direction.

      Reply
  8. sunset ltd

    clear on most things. will you check my understanding of can tapping please? 1. when pulling vacuum to start, the only valves that should be open are 1, 5, and the blue valve on the butane tank, yes? 2. when evacuating the cans into the tank, it makes more sense to me to close the red valve on the butane tank instead of just #4. you conserve a little more gas and you don't run the risk of bursting #4. 3. at class, instead of just hooking the tapper to the yellow vacuum hose, you had a stubby piece of 1/4" with a ball valve on it. got a picture? it's what, 1/4 female flare w/ ball valve to 1/4 male flare?

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      For starters, open all valves but the butane supply valve number 4 and pump all of the atmosphere containing oxygen out of the system. Close vacuum pump valve number 1 and turn off vacuum pump. To tap cans close vent valve 2 and dump valve 3, and start up the recovery pump. Disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and attach it to the can tapper, via a short whip with a ball valve. Make sure ball valve is closed and then open valve number 1. Tap the can and open the ball valve on the whip to tranfer the butane into the Terpenator tank, where it is pumped away as a vapor and deposited into the storage tank. Close the valve on the whip when the pressure reaches 0 psi, and tap a new can, before opening it again. Not much risk of an ANSI 150lb valve bursting at -14.7 psi, or plus 50 psi, which is the maximum range it should see during butane transfer. No picture of the whip, but it is a JB Kobra and we got it from RSD refrigeration supply. It has a female flare on one end and a male on the other. You can use Valve #1 instead, but can't do it as easily sitting back in a chair.

      Reply
  9. OutdoorEnzo

    I was contemplating a larger manually operated mk III type unit based upon 2"x36" column on a 10" spool and going to a 3/8" downtube & valve instead of 1/4", using the appion and other peripherals from mk III. Do you think that would be a feasible scenario?. Would using the same 1.5" x 1" ball dump valve with a 1.5" x 2" concentric reducer be appropriate for the larger 2" column? I am also working on a simple system that pumps and recircs hot or warm water up from the soup warmer, and down around the column that works real good to keep column from getting or staying to cold, that I will share once it is dialed in. Do you see any problematic issues with either of these Ideas? Thanks, OE

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      No, as long as the intake to the recovery pump is far enough above the bursting butane bubbles to not aspirate them, after you've dumped a full column, you can use various sized columns and lower tanks. The more tank surface area that you have relative to its depth, the faster it will boil off. A tall skinnier column is generally more efficient for extraction, than a short fat one. Any column over about 36" can get to be a pain to unload, unless you use air pressure.

      Reply
  10. tylerdurden71

    any reason why the outfit associated with skunkpharm that is putting together these kits doesn't return emails??

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      Hi, Tyler. Great handle! Sorry for the delayed response. There has been a rush of inquiries in the last week. It seems you have somehow slipped between the cracks. I have kits in stock and am making all efforts to keep parts on hand at all times so that anyone wishing may get one immediately. If that is your desire, please do call Specialized land line, 503 775-5003. I will give you the appropriate information to make you decision. I look forward to talking to you!

      Reply
  11. Granite

    Yesterday I ran a cycle when my appion started clanking something fierce. I might have missed my count and I think that the pump sucked in oil filled liquid. Seems like I destroyed the pump(at least it will need a rebuild). Have you ever had a pump make bad sounds? I think I'm going to have to rebuild the pump, but don't know which parts

    Reply
  12. Randal

    GW greetings, we were going to schedule a day to do the hexane wash. I will be at Carla's on Wednesday. Also I don’t have a lab (yet) or the materials. Just some green ETHO that needs a bath. Randal

    Reply
  13. BudHappy

    If I make an absolute with vacumm purging and never heat it, after winterization and removal of waxes and such, can it still be buttered? or will it just be shatter/glass. My oil always turns hard unless I decarb it, then it becomes pliable.

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      Sorry, don't know the answer to that one, as I've never tried to make budder on purpose. I have never ended up with budder by accident, after winterizing either, and have with the waxes remaining, so I suspect it has some effects. GW

      Reply
  14. Bryan Cone

    I contacted specialised and they have not replied. Are they still up and running or is it time to really buckle down and study the tutorial? Thanks!!

    Reply
  15. tommmy

    hey grey wolf hope your feeling better i built a unit like dk double kindness works great but i keep blowing the orings out on the piston in the manifold gauge set i use a yellow jacket one for R134. Would there be any stainless steel option maybe an instrument manifold valve from anderson greenwood ? I use a vacuum charging (part #18975) to pull a vacuum on the system and introduce butane through a can tapper and the valve core seems to get blown out also. Are there chemical resistant valve cores? I got the system working well but i know it could be better. I also have a hard time recovering all the tane. I shut the low side gauge off and flip the recovery tank over and place it in a ice bath and the g5 is now pushing into to the high side of the gauge and then down the yellow center line to the recovery tank. but even when i draw the system to a full vacuum when i take it apart it still has some butane in it ? any suggestions would be greatly appreciated thanks wolfman

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      Adhere to KISS. I would pitch the manifold set, as you don't need it and it is just more plumbing and resistance to gas flows. You only need a single compound gauge to tell what is going on in your system, attached directly to the pressure pot. Mine is attached via hose with 1/4" flare fittings. I picked the gauge I like best from RSD refrigeration supply, but looking at my parts list, I don't have the number. I used a stainless compound gauge from Paramount supply on the Mk II, but it doesn't have the fine graduations I prefer, so let me get the RSD number and I will add it to our published parts list. In your case, I suspect that you can remove one of the gauges from your manifold set and adapt it for reuse. I remove all the Schrader valves and pitch them. Not only do they not last, they aren't required and are just another resistance to flow. We introduce butane from a refrigeration recovery tank, which we may fill using a can tapper, so we connect the can tapper to the system via a hose with a ball valve in near the tapper, so we can shut it off between cans. We also chill the butane recovery tank, and then burp off any non condensable gases sucked into the system from atmospheric leaks. If you connect your recovery hose directly to the recovery tank using 3/8" or larger, and measure vacuum at the connection point to the tank, using a simple compound gauge, when you reach -22"Hg with the Appion, you are about as high as you are going to get, unless you are also heating the collection pot to around 212F or so, with the refrigerant recovery tank sitting in ice water. On the other hand, at -22"Hg, there is only about 25% of the atmosphere remaining in the pot, and it is vapor as opposed to liquid. There is a ratio of 233:1 between vapor and liquid, so if you do the math, you will see that it is a few pennies worth of butane. For instance, a Mk III Terpenator collection tank, has about a 5.75"ID and is 6" tall, making it 156 cubic inches or 2556 ml internal capacity. 1- 22"/29" Hg x 2556 ml = 650 ml remaining vapor. 650ml/233 = 2.8 ml liquid butane left in collection tank. A 300 ml can of Lucienne sells for $2.29 locally, so a ml costs $0.0076 and the 2.8 ml left in the tank costs $0.02. When we reach -22"Hg, we switch off the recovery pump, and turn on the high vacuum rotary vane pump, to finish at -29.9" Hg. That pumps the 650 ml of remaining vapor, off to atmosphere, at a loss of two cents worth of butane. Yielding a slightly less than average 20%, because it is a nice round number, a 150 gram column load would produce about 30 grams of BHO Absolute, so that is $0.00067 per gram. Besides saving time, it saves the Appion pump, which doesn't like to be run dry, and its upper seals won't last very long under those conditions. Alas, at the end of the day, even if you pull -22" on the intake side of the Appion and then close the inlet valve, followed by the outlet valve, the line between the Appion and the recovery tank, is still going to have butane at tank pressure on it. If the tanks contents includes propane, even a tank reduced to 30F in an iced brine bath will still have pressure on it, and so will the hose. If it is n-butane and you cool it down before removing the hose, little to none is lost, because the pressure is close to zero.

      Reply
      1. tommmy

        thanks wolfman you are the foremost authority on this extraction process and keep up the good work. i make a variety of mesh filtering screens, agitation devices, etc check out my website and if you want anything hit me up and i will send some out to you for free thanks

        Reply
        1. skunkpharmresearch

          Thanks for the good thoughts and kind offer bro! I checked out your site and it does look like you have some interesting products to offer,so may I make a proposition? We will test anything you want to send us no strings attached and honestly publish the results as we see them, on our site and the cannabis forums that we frequent. Similar to what we did with the KO Domeless nail and HMK swing pipe. Would such an arrangement interest you?

          Reply
      2. Tech Buddy

        Hi GW - did you manage to find the part number for the gauge you use? They seem to have only one compound refrigeration gauge - the RIT 49138. Is that it? http://www.rsd.net/search/item.php?item_no=RIT+49138

        Reply
        1. skunkpharmresearch

          We considered using a teflon bag, similar to what FOAF developed, but haven't considered coating it. I typically eschew Teflon coatings, as they seldom stay put over time. The biggest reason we didn't follow up on the Teflon bags, is that we winterize 99% of the oil that we extract anyway, and it is easy to just wash the pot out with hot ethanol. For those applications where we don't winterize, the top and bottom both come off of the Mk IIIA, so we just use a plastic squeegy to scrape most of it up, and wash out the remainder with alcohol.

          Reply
  16. Rob

    We've built a MkIII, bought a G5, yellow jacket hoses, we continue to clean a greasy, oily film from the bottom, even after taking the pump completely apart and cleaning all the excess grease. How does one clean everything and know that your results are grease free? Thanks for sharing.

    Reply
  17. Sam

    looking at your designs, i cant help but feel like your tanks are a little bit on the large side... how close do you get to matching the column volume with the tank volume with your largest column? TIA, Sam.

    Reply
  18. Sam

    hey Wolf, I'm putting a "micro" terp together using 4"x6" spools for the tanks and 1-1/2"x18" for the column, its for personal use. how much of the extraction tank do you reckon i can safely fill up with liquid gas without worrying about the solution coming up through the line in the beginning stages of the evaporation phase? TIA, Sam.

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      The Mk III has 4.4" clearance using a 24" column, which works. You can also put a labyrinth on the intake, but it is just something else to keep clean. Part of the secret to the speed of the Mk III, is surface area under vacuum. A 4" sanitary spool will be in the neighborhood of 3.75" ID, which will give you a surface area of about 11 in/sq, where a six inch has 26 in/sq, so it will work, but be slower during the recovery cycle.

      Reply
  19. Budforever442200

    How do you do your first cleaning runs? I have done 3 clean runs and still have oil. Thanks again. I will be sending you some pictures soon. It is a very beautiful machine.

    Reply
  20. Safety Team

    Ive often wondered of the hazards of using these HVAC pumps to remove flammable liquids. Mainly because they all say the same thing in the operating manuals. Pumps that remove flammable liquid/vapors (safely) are costly, although Id think they would be worth the price considering the potential alternative scenario. So... How do you use the Appion G5 twin for butane recovery?

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      Good question and thanks for sharing sections of the Appion manual with us, which I've excluded due to space, but strongly encourage anyone using, or contemplating one, to read the owners manual. What it says is that pumping inflammable liquids can be hazardous, and they don't offer or recommend their equipment for that purpose. Specifically because they can't guarantee that the operator will properly attach the hoses leak free, and that the flammable gases won't be pulled through the electric motor brushes and ignited. I don't blame them, I wouldn't assume that liability either, and for what it is worth, the last thing I do before opening any valves, is to double check all the hose connections, and in fact, don't consider the Appion the prime choice for the application. We also don't recommend anyone's pump for this application, but are telling you what we are using. Your choice of pump, is your business, and with it goes the liability of your choice. In addition, despite this being an enclosed system, we don't use it indoors. Even with our fully automated Mk II located in a ventilated exhaust cabinet, the pumps and butane tank are still outside, with a fan blowing away any vapors. Not only can bad connections leak, so can valve stems and any number of other possibilities that seldom happen. We recommend always setting up and using the equipment with the thought in mind, that even if something goes wrong, you stay safe. Having said that, we are continuing to search out the perfect pump solution, and will announce it when we find it. What is required is a design that runs without lubricant in the upper end and isolates its crankcase from contamination and dilution. It needs to be able to pump down to around -22"Hg and up to at least 60 psi and be explosion proof, as well as affordable. Any reader input on options are appreciated.

      Reply
      1. Tech Buddy

        Have you tried the Yellow Jacket RecoverXLT pump? Seems to have similar specs, except auto shut off at -15" (where you want to run to -22"). But using your previous calculations the difference between -15 and -22 is about the same as -22 to -29... in other words $0.02 worth of Butane. It does seem to have lower recovery rates though - significant enough to take a fair amount of additional time per cycle. I'm mainly curious because I can pick up the RecoverXLT locally but can't seem to find the G5Twin. Thanks again!

        Reply
        1. skunkpharmresearch

          Sorry no experience with the Yellow Jacket, but the specs look good and I've heard of people lauding them for our use. It is oil less, which is a key requirement, but I can't find enough information on their construction to form an opinion.

          Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      We use a CPS VP6D and a Robinair 5 cfm two stage vane pumps to evacuate the systems. We use an Appion G5 twin refrigerant recovery pump to reclaim the butane. We would love to feature a blog detailing the various pumps that would work, but alas none of us have made a deep enough study to support a serious article. What I was looking for when I selected the Appion, was an oiless design, where the butane was never in contact with the pumps crankcase or lubrication system. I first tried an inexpensive Micro Vac II, which didn't work out well and then the Appion, which works like a charm after hundreds of hours. Part of the problem with the Micro Vac II was poor quality control, resulting in the inlet valve being misclocked, and the rest may have been running cylinders dry of any lubrication, which brings us to the topic of pump life and rebuild kits. The upper ends of recovery pumps are typically designed for ease of rebuild, because they periodically do require upper end seal replacement. Periodically, can be frequently if your process doesn't accodate their weakness, which is that as the pump reduces the system pressure, it reduces the amount of butane that is acting as a lubricant to the piston seals. At high vacuum, there is little to no lubrication present. I first started insisting on 100% reclaim, but soon discovered that vacuums higher than about 22"Hg, took forever to achieve with the recovery pump, and after calculating that the difference between the -29.5" vacuum that I wanted to achieve, and 22"Hg, was about 25% of the volume of my recovery vessel and considering that the ratio between butane liquid and vapor,is about 233:1, I was laboring to save less than one cents worth of butane. I therefore changed the process to pump off the remaining butane above -22"Hg, using the high vacuum pump, which purges the remainder in seconds, without pump damage. We found a few industrial liquid gas pumps, and some labratory pumps that would ostensibly work for recovery, but are expensive, and not needed at the small about a ~pound an hour scale that we are operating at. There are a number of larger Terpenators being built based on FOAF's and my work, and as they share their solutions with me, I will share them with you, unless of course if they ask me not to share their proprietary secrets. GW

      Reply
  21. ryan-i

    wow! thanks for all of the legwork you've done! i was actually planning to purchase a tamisium this week and just came across this while looking for reviews. i'm thinking i will build an mkIII now, but have a couple of questions.... between the l'il terpenator and mkIII there are a few different supplies lists, some with machine shop labor and some without - is it possible to build without having parts machined? Also, time is of the essence, hence considering the tamisium; would it be feasible to gather parts and complete the build over a couple of days? i'm in portland and have easy access to the supplies.

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      I haven't come up with a way to build a Terpenator without some machining and welding, but if you are in Portland, there are a lot of resources. If you are in a real hurry, you might check with Specialized Formulations to see if any of their first 5 piece run of Mk III manufactured parts kits are still left. 4 were spoken for last I heard, and they haven't yet been advertized. The rest of the parts, except for a couple of seals, are an easy pickup at Glacier Tank on Airport Way, and Paramount Supply on about SE 8th and Ash, or you might talk to Specialized Formulations about picking up all the parts for you. If Carla is going there for parts anyway, she probably won't charge you any more to do so, and the part cost is the same. Until Glacer Tank receives their order, the special seals have to be ordered, but delivery has been good. Glacier Tank has agreed to stock them, and Rochelle at their number will know their status. GW

      Reply
          1. ryan-i

            i emailed Spec.Formulations this am and haven't heard back... if you're in regular contact, you could mention that i'm interested if it's available. thanks!

            Reply
  22. Anonamouse

    Thanks so much for your work on this, GW. Your engineering is really pushing the state of the art forward and hopefully will lead to safer outcomes. As a comp sci nerd, future clinical oncologist, and rookie engineer I salute you and what you've done for our community.

    Reply
Join the conversation!
  or