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Lu lu lu lu lu lu lu lu lu lu, ahwoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!1 Welcome to the bright new age, all ya'll like minded brothers and sister women! Let's make it an enlightened one!!!
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Hello. Which would you recommend is best for extractions? Wheat, Cane or corn alcohol?
190 proof from any of those sources works equally as well. GW
[…] Alkanes, Alcohols, and Ethers | Skunk Pharm … – Ever asked yourself exactly what are the Alkanes, Alcohols, and Ethers commonly used for cannabis extraction and alchemy made of? Fortunately, one doesn’t have to … […]
When I try to winterize my run turns to complete gelatin (won't pour). Just wondering what I'm doing wrong. Has this happened to anyone and what should I be doing? Using an extractor (bho) and everclear.
Howdy, I was looking for a good solvent to make RSO in a megahome style distiller designed for alcohol. How does this solvent sound for this type of project? http://www.sciencecompany.com/-P16859.aspx?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shop&utm_campaign=prod&utm_content=NC-12886&gclid=CNPWqp267sACFQiDfgodMWwA3g Thanks Pete
dont do it bro.. not safe... just evaporate it and eat the money.
Hello...thanks for all you Folks do!.... What do you recommend for winterizing? I have used Everclear but it is to expensive. Can you all provide any less expensive options to Everclear?.. Thanks!
Methanol works better than ethanol. Check out the MSDS before using. http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9924648
There's a solvent that I've been wanting to try out lately but I don't have anything close to a closed loop system. The solvent I'm talking about is DiMethyl Ether, it is the ether of methanol and it is mostly used in the extraction of proteins from meat products for use in the food industry. It's toxicity is comparable to butane and its boiling point is -11 degrees Fahrenheit so it's got some good qualities as a solvent, the polar affinity of an ether with a very low boiling point making it easy to purge from extracts at lower temperatures meaning less degradation and evaporstion of terpenes. The best way I can think of to use this solvent is during a winterization procedure, after removing the fats, where it would be employed to make the extract much more viscous in an attempt to make the acetone-extract mixture easier to evaporate at lower temperatures to result in a finished absolute which still contains tons of terpenes. Think it over and tell me if its a solid idea or if I'm dead wrong.
Correction: Diethyl has evil spirits in it, not Dimethyl. We have almost assemble a test unit to attempt extraction and recycle using dimethyl ether.
Love this site it is the best ever, i make butane hash oil using fresh frozen material and then winterize, I have winterized with many different solvents but I have produced the most true fullmelt and terpene intact absolute using 99.9%virgin acetone! it seems to be very easy to remove the residual solvent under vacuum. I would love to hear your thoughts on this method. I've also been able to more consistently produce shatter absolutes. I also make rick Simpson oil with the acetone and have had very potent and clean oil if the solvent and material is frozen. Also I read that residual acetone is broken down in the body and safely processed into glucose while residual isopropyl is oxidized in the body to acetone. So much respect for this website you guys rock, please give me your input on these methods
We don't use acetone, because it is a known female reproductive system toxin. http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927062
With regards to Methanol, would VP Racing Fuels: M1 (99.85% Methanol) be suitable for extractions? It costs ~$40 per 5 gallons, which as solvents go is a pretty good bang for buck.
The only MSDS sheets that I could find for VP Methanol racing fuel, says that it also includes a complex mixture of hydrocarbons, which are unidentified. Do you have an MSDS sheet for the brand you are eyeing?
www.vpracingfuels.com/download/MSDS_M1_Sep08.pdf
The MSDS doesn't show anything but methanol, with the balance ostensibly water, but as it is a fuel, rather than a reagent grade, so without further testing it is a best guess. You might pay for a GC analysis to check it for impurities yourself.
Thanks for the great input on high noon this week & also this amazing site. I have learned a lot from both. There was a question about lab versions of Naphtha. As far as I understand, in the UK at least, this is known as 'petroleum ether' or 'petroleum spirits' & is available from lab supplies companies.
Petroleum ether is primarily Pentane and Hexane and is available in the US as well. Always read the MSDS when you select a brand, as the contents are not specifically spelled out either.
Yo, that's what's up truthfully.
What about using Diethyl Ether (CAS # 60-29-7) == is the procedure the same as with butane? Soak, filter, vacuum purge, light low heat? Or is there an added step? Also will ether extract more or less of the chlorophyll -- or is it simply a function of soak time.
Butane has a dielectric constant of 1.4, Hexane a 2.0 and Diethyl ether 4.33, so it is still relatively non polar, but more polar that Butane. http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/liquid-dielectric-constants-d_1263. The extraction technique would be more like the techniques we posted for Hexane.
Would high grade heptane grab more of the essentials than the others, being the longest chain? And for its length, it's supposedly easier on the nervous-system than hexane, how would that be? Appreciate your wisdom, js
Heptane does a nice extraction, but is even harder to purge than Hexane.
Thanks. What is the difference between "Industrial" HEXANE TO "LAB "GRADE? If the Industrial is 100% hexane not recycled,etc.
HPLC reagent grade is free enough of contaminants, that nothing shows up on a HPLC or GC. 100% seems unusually pure for an industrial grade. Do you have the MSDS for it?
no,it was picked up by someone else.
You can usually find the MSDS on line using Google.
no brand name,locally packaged
Hi,Could a person use the acetone to do a water wash like one would use hexane? As I would do a everclear wash at the end to make sure to get rid of as much acetone as possible.
It takes a non polar solvent like hexane, which is imiscible in water, so they separate. Acetone is polar, and mixes readily with water.
thanks ,I was thinking that but now I know for sure.
is denatured alcohol dangerous to use for winterization? i couldnt find the boilng point under a vacuum for the isobutyl ketone, just the atmospheric point which is at 250F! Anyhow i purged for 8 hours at 135 and it seems to be ok but i am wondering if i redisolve it in IPA will this assist in removing any more nasties? next time denatured wont be used this was an accident.
You could winterize with denatured, but not as well because most of the denaturing agents used are more aggresive a solvent than ethanol. If you are refering to Methyl isobutyl ketone (MIBK), I show a boiling point @ 760mm Hg of 115°C (239°F). There is a good nomograph for calculating boiling points at reduced vacuum: http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/chemistry/solvents/learning-center/nomo-assets.html
jobs a goodin folks Health and happiness
just Two? I have seen some of Eloquent's outstanding work. What a pair to draw to!! is it ok to link to this site from the forums? when speaking extractions? GW and skunkpharm is required reading. thanks again beans
Feel free to share any of our content on other forums. Our goal is to spread the word!
Sir!! (or Ma'am) ;) Just wanted to stop by and say hello and kudos for all that you do. Hope you all have a verrrry merry holiday Beans....
Both actually! It takes two of us guys to almost keep up with our gal, and speaking for all of us'ns, thanks for the good thoughts and hoping you have a stellar holiday too! GW
What about using Acetone or Naptha?
Acetone works, as does naphtha. Except for trying them out, we don't use either, because we don't have to and because we extract meds for other people. We stay with food grade polar solvents for oral consumption. We use Isopropyl or denatured alcohol for topicals, either which is cheaper than acetone here locally. Acetone is polar and aggressive, so freezing it and the material to -18C/0F, and pouring the acetone through the material suspended in a French Chinoise strainer, is the best method we've found. As there is interest, I will add acetone to the list of processes to document and offer on our site. "Naphtha" can mean a lot of things, and all that designation tells you, is the boiling point range of 30C to 200C, not what is in it. Even when narrowed down to "Light Naphtha", with a boiling point between 30C and 90C, it doesn't simply mean hydrocarbon chains 5 and 6 carbons long like Pentane and Hexane, it can mean any and all hydrocarbons boiling in that temperature range. If you Google Light Naphtha MSDS, and look at the different mixes that different manufacturers put in their Light Naphtha, you will see graphically what I mean. Some of those ringed molecules are on watch lists as carcinogens, mutagens, or teratogens. Both Pentane, and Hexane are both excellent choices for extraction, and a Light Naphtha mixture containing only those two constitutes would be excellent, but unless you can find such a source, that is not subject to change when the manufacturer's surplus balances shift, it is far safer to just buy Pentane or Hexane. GW
Wow, excellent response. I should have said light naptha and if it wasn't clear, in all of this I am talking about oil for internal use (ingesting). The first time I started doing this, I was using 99% iso. It worked good, but the one store that had it for sale here, stopped selling it. I was given a list (which I don't have now), of other things I could use. The only two that are readily available here are naptha and acetone. Naptha though, I have to order 45 gallon drums of it. That just isn't reasonable at the moment, so I was left with acetone. I used it and it did seem to work, although I sure didnt use your methods. I soaked the bud in the acetone for 15 minutes, strained and squished it, then added more acetone and let it soak again. I then only boiled it down once. The oli seemed fine, tasted pretty much identical to what it did when I used the ISO and seemed to have the same effects. After reading this page, I really started to wonder what the best way to use the acetone was. I will try it differently next time. I can't freeze it to -18, (unless its winter here of course), but I can stick them in our food freezer for a while first. The idea of just pouring it through the bud does worry me in terms of wasting bud, so I will likey immerse it all, but just not let it soak for more then a second or two. Should I still render it down and filter it multiple times using acetone? Also, I am under the impression that acetone leaves no traces behind, so there should be no reason I shouldnt be doing this for ingestible oil... is this right? lol
Soaking plant material in Iso or acetone for 15 minutes would produce similar results, in that they would extract a boat load of chlorophyll. The frozen material and chilled acetone pour through, is designed to reduce that. If you don't find chlorophyll objectionable, those extra steps aren't necessary. It doesn't get cold enough here either, even in winter, so we use our freezer to get down to -18C/0F. Not sure what you mean by rendering it down and filtering multiple times. Could you elaborate? All solvent extraction leaves residual solvent, though properly done, the levels are far below those of health concern. GW
On one of your pages (can't remember which one now), you talk about boiling the iso/oil down, adding more iso, freezing it, filtering it and then doing it all again... The act of boiling it down is what I meant by rendering it. Do I find the chlorophyll objectionable? I really have no clue as going by what you said, I've only had it with lots in it. If I just pour the acetone into the pail, stir it and dump it back out right away, will that make a noticable difference in the amount of chlorophyl?
You may be referring to my post on re-dissolving ISO (C3H8O) extracts in hot Ethanol (C2H6O), dropping the temperature, and filtering, to get rid of those things soluble in ISO, but not Ethanol aka EtOH. If that is the case, it gets filtered as an ISO solution, and again as an chilled -18C/0F EtOH solution. To answer your last question, yes, a soak and dump technique will work, but as you note, soak time will be a matter of seconds and gets most of it the first shot. With a pour through, you have to use a repack and do one than one extraction, to get it all. My first Acetone extraction was in a large mouth quart canning jar, using trim at outside ambient temperatures in the low 80's and with a 20 second soak and gentle shake at the start and one in the middle and end, before opening the jar and upending the contents into a wire strainer for a fast drain. After filtering the solution through a commercial restaurant sized coffee filter, I evaporated off the Acetone with a fan and no added heat, until visibly gone. It produced a dark green extract, which would not all re-dissolve in boiling 190 proof Ethanol, and after the Ethanol was chilled more material filtered out. Despite the double filtration, the solution was still dark green, as was the end product. If I were going to repeat that soak experiment, I would freeze my Acetone, and experimental stash in pint canning jars, and then give different soaking times a try. Shouldn't take many trials to narrow down 20 seconds, starting at 5 seconds. I would dry my material to around ~15% water content, and break it up loosely by hand, without creating a bunch of fines. The stuff we want, is on the outside of the plant material, so it isn't necessary to break the material up fine to increase the surface area of broken leaf margins. In point of fact, the fewer broken leaf margins the better. That is where the chlorophyll is leached out. Dumping through a wire strainer to separate the plant material from the solvent faster, and re-filtering with a paper filter, worked out well and I would do that again, The fan worked well as well for rapidly evaporating off the Acetone, but we don't live in a dusty environment. After evaporating away all visible Acetone, I would wash it out of the evaporation dish with hot ethanol and re-filter after chilling. I would then place that in a 250F hot oil bath, and boil off the ethanol, then continue until it was decarboxylated to the level I wanted, based on bubble generation. Hope that helps narrow your focus, and you have fun with your experiments! GW
Hi GW, Would this "light" Naphtha be acceptable according to the MSDS? Would you be comfortable using this? Thanks for your response http://64.26.129.203/_profiles/_msds/14-434.pdf
Fuel grade isn't something I would ingest.
Taking this further, I purchased twenty-four solvents for testing, here's a list arranged as to solvent polarity, https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=7933632&postcount=162 How I ordered, received, and inspected each solvent is described in detail within the thread, simply enter the solvent name in the Search this Thread box at the top of any page of the thread. Within the thread you'll also find how I primarily based my choices on the FDA USP Residual Solvent toxicity classification lists, the solvents chosen are from the Class 3 list, with a few gleaned from the Class 2 list. https://hmc.usp.org/sites/default/files/documents/HMC/GCs-Pdfs/c467.pdf
What about Ethyl Acetate? Is that not a better thc solvent than any of the Simple Alkane Alcohols?
Ostensibly so!