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The Mk IVA Phoenix Terpenator

 Behold the Mk IV Phoenix, risen from the ashes of the Chimera and embracing everything that we've learned to this point.

This prototype has a 10" X 12" lower spool and a 4" X 36" column.  I put that size column on it for a January shoot out in Seattle, but it will accept anything from a 2" X 24" column up to a 4" X 36" column.

One of the things that we've learned and which has been addressed in the Mk IVA, and that is that stainless to stainless threaded fittings can be problematic, so the IVA uses welded manifolds, rather than manifolds assembled out of pipe fittings.

 It has two sight glasses to monitor what is going on, and has a thermocouple in the tank, to monitor the internal temperature during processing.

Read more at /the-mk-iva-phoenix-terpenator/:

Mk IV Prototype-1-1Mk IV Prototype-1-3

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0 Comments

  1. Monty Lobo

    What would you recommend my temp and inHg pressure be for making shatter at 5,300 feet elevation? Full vacuum at 5,300 is -26 Temp is ?

    Reply
    1. Skunk Pharm Research,LLC

      At 5300 feet, there is only about 25.17" Hg to start with, so you have an adjustment factor of about 4.75", so would suggest -24.75" Hg at 115F. GW

      Reply
  2. Andrea Meneghetti

    Hi guys, I have a big problem with my oils. Not a lot of problems making shatter and I love it. I follow gray wolf method (thin film vaccum 115f @ 29.5 hg) and sometimes I have hard shatter. My problems are when I want to do some wax honeycomb. All people say I have to go to 135-140 f. But a that temp my oils became always liquid and it seem normal to me. What am I wrong? Here in this fucking Spain people ask for wax or honeycomb so I have to learn that. The only time I made wax -honeycomb is when I put temp at 90-95 for many hours. Why? How I can solidify my bho in honeycomb consistency? How I can have a solid products? Maybe the liquid shit I see needs to be dry at room temp? I'm in tilt and I' m close to became crazy with those oil.

    Reply
    1. isolation chamber

      Depends on your starting material because different strains have different amounts of inactive ingredients, more inactive ingredients means less pure results wax or honeycomb. Shatter and winterized concentrates have less inactive ingredients because of purging processes.

      Reply
    1. Skunk Pharm Research,LLC

      I interpret your question as, "If you do not wish to decarboxylate the material during purge, do you use lower temperatures?" If that is your question, the answer is yes. To vacuum purge, the viscosity of the material needs to be low enough for the bubbles to readily escape. Heat lowers the viscosity, so I heat the material in a thin film until it reaches that state, but no hotter. Usually between 100F/115F. I use 125F for ethanol purging, because otherwise the solution blows enormous bubbles that defy bursting without bumping vacuum levels. GW

      Reply
  3. Austin

    I am in anchorage alaska. Can anyone please help me understand the elevation conversion chart for my elevation. Google tells me its 102.

    Reply
    1. Skunk Pharm Research,LLC

      You have to extrapolate. Sea level is 29.9" Hg and 500 feet elevation is 29.4" Hg. 29.9 - 29.4 = .5 .5/500 X 102= .102" Hg pressure loss at 102 feet elevation, which leaves 29.798" Hg. Roughly one inch per 1000 feet pressure drop. GW

      Reply
    2. Meds

      Just get stronger better pumps everyone and you wont have to worry about all this elevation stuff so much. Unless you live in the himalayas or in a crator miles below sea leval

      Reply
      1. Ungia mahna

        Sorry if i cone across rude, i font mean too. But in the beginning of this article you warn us about delta9 reaching boiling point with pumps that are to strong. So what is the lowest cfm/hp one should aim for? Is there a way to calculate it without actually buying and testing the vacuum pump? Im eager to learn all I can about this!

        Reply
  4. Beau Timms

    What turns BHO black? To much heat? I live in Oregon, happy smoking. I keep getting amber oil after the initial run but after I purge it, it turns dark. Is the heat to high? I check the heat with an IR gun and it's always the exact same, 105°F. Should I raise the temp? Wax taste great after a two day purge, no butane left that I can tell.

    Reply
    1. Skunk Pharm Research,LLC

      The C-30 anthro cyanin plant pigments add the most color, and exhibit the Beers/Lambert effect. A thin layer may be bright and clear, while two thin layers may approach opacity. They are also glucosides (plant sugars) which caramelize and darken with heat. We extract at subzero temperatures to minimize our C-30 molecule pickup. GW

      Reply
  5. Beau Timms

    It's science but not complicated if you know what your desired output should be. Took about two weeks of experimentation but I've achieved my desired output and have done so every time now without fail. Good luck to you'all and happy dabbing!!! I've got something new I've been working on but it's very complicated. I'm talking A-THC. : )

    Reply
  6. luispsyfer

    so i have only been closed loop extracting for a short period of time n i have the extraction end prosses down decent on color n pull. my only question is on the vac purg side ive been trying to make crumble/cookie and have been getting more of a unstable shatter look id like to know what people are using fir temps and vac pressure and how long they are letting it sit in oven i need a step by strep proses to achive a stable crumble ?? plz help

    Reply
  7. stephen

    anyone know if Shatter will re set if I was to reheat and let set? I ask because I've got several small runs and would like to make it one large slab :D

    Reply
  8. steve

    Any one want to know how real chemistry guy would do it and what there not telling you here or anywhere? I use a 12 liter round bottom reaction vessel with 3 neck head heated by a glas col mantle a liebig condenser and receiving flask. Vacucum is a diaphragm vacuum pump which can pull about -740mmhg. If you are using an oil sealed vac you got from harbor freight, your stupid.your making poison. I will also note that I have a thermometer and manometer on my apparatus. You should always know the temp and pressure of your system. If you don't, stop your stupid.stop killing people slog. Because your vac gauge on your $150 pump says you are at 29mmhg does not make it so. The science of pulling a full vacuume on planet earth is a very deep and complex. And it is in fact impossible. At best anyone here is doing an intermittent distillation under reduced pressure. Not a vacuum. Sorry harbor freght pumps and rice cookers. A real lab pump will cost you at least $500 for a weak one that can maybe pull 22-23 hg. Mine is about $1000. Have control over the heat. Hot plate in a sealed home made chamber. Bad idea. Stop. At different temps and pressures different things are happening. Just microwaving a pyrex dish and throwing it in the chamber for a minute makes poison. Not thc. Your evap or purge taking several days? Your product is loaded with residual solvent I promise you.even when you think it's done, it's still there. In a nut shell, this is serious organic chemistry You people are attempting to Execute with crude equipment and zero knowledge. Research, invest in the propper equipment.

    Reply
    1. Daron

      I've pulled a hundred microns with many different setups. A hundred microns wasnt good enough for what I was doing. You can get a hundred microns with some pretty outdated vane style pumps. And you (could) pick them up for not much back in the day. Just did a quick ebay search and you can find a used alcatel direct drive for 150 bucks. It'll get you to 100 microns easily. If you wanted to get anal about it, you could get a higher end pump and run a turbo vac inline with your mechanical pump and then youd get as close to a perfect vacuum as your going to get for under 10000. You could install some filters and traps which would help reclame solvents, protect your pump lubricant and ensure that no vapours got past your pumps exhaust filter.... Not really sure what the point of the post is. Beating your chest with your "knowledge" or??? It's not really rocket science.

      Reply
      1. François

        It's not rocket science so why take risks? I checked everything he said and it makes sens. If you are going to concentrate pounds of weed in oz of thc spending 2000$ to do it right should not be an issue, especially if it guaranty you quality.

        Reply
  9. Billy D

    Are there any negatives to reclaiming isopropyl alcohol? I was considering buying a 3 gallon stovetop still so I can get my alcohol back for reuse

    Reply
    1. Gary

      I use a Black and Decker rice cooker with a 3/8th vent hole in the glass lid, which it comes with.and attach a length of surgical tubing from the vent hole to a coil of 1/4" copper tubing which is essentially a still. You cool the coil with ice and collect the IPA into a container below. I can reclaim up to 80% of my alcohol... maybe more at times.

      Reply
  10. Good Vacuum Pump For Bho | Best Lightweight Vacuum

    […] Vacuum Purging and Processing Tips | Skunk Pharm … – Hi ive been reading alot on this site and love it but SWIM has been making bho and it seems to take a week to two weeks to vacuum purge this is bring the vac to full … […]

    Reply
    1. FishmanK

      Is SWiM using heat? Vac pressures? Kinda like fine wine making maybe... you have to finesse the art of it If SWiM gets the great results...

      Reply
  11. mike rycc

    Hi ive been reading alot on this site and love it but SWIM has been making bho and it seems to take a week to two weeks to vacuum purge this is bring the vac to full vac leaving pressure sealed at -29.5 and turning the vacuum back on for a half hour every 4 hours or so to help pop bubbles. SWIM leave the patty on one side till no more bubbles then flips purges till no bubbles wondering if he is doin sumthin wrong or if he is one of the few doing it right because ive yet to hear of anyone purging this long but his oil is always the smoothest thanks love skunkpharm

    Reply
    1. Freddy Flapjack

      Try thinning it out more to expose more surface area and lessen the thickness the butane needs to travel through to be pulled from the bottom of your patty to the surface. Also, introduce "atmosphere". Take it out for a few minutes, collect it, carefully spread and put back in oven.

      Reply
    2. steve

      He is not really pulling 29.5 nobody is unless your in a real lab. Then maybe. Know your temp and pressure and where your solvent should boil at those ranges

      Reply
  12. Jim

    Hello GW. I would like to say congrats on the work you guys are doing. The info you guys are getting out is priceless and doing nothing but good for the cause. My question is about vacuuming oil. I don't understand why people think one MUST use a vacuum. It is my understanding that putting a material under vacuum lowers its boiling point. Therefore, there should be no difference, from a chemistry standpoint, if one was to take the oil up to 212F with water or 240F with cooking oil in a double boiler. Am I missing something? Could you respond to my email? I'm sure more questions will follow. Thank you and keep up the amazing work.

    Reply
    1. steve

      Correct vacuum is not necessary. One can distill the solvent at normal pressure and higher temps. We use vacuume to reduce these temps and protect volatile compounds

      Reply
        1. Gabriel Pretto

          This is a good point, and something I have been wondering myself. If the boiling point of the compounds dissolved in your solvent lower at the same rate as the solvent's boiling point itself then why use a vacuum? Forget about reclaiming solvent I'm talking purely from the perspective of removing solvent from desirables while losing the least amount of volatiles possible (terps). Presumably the boiling points of the terpenes and Cannabinoids lower at the same rate as the solvent's boiling point, so therefore pulling a vacuum would then make no difference in preserving those volatile compounds which we are attempting to isolate. Theoretically just being precise with heat and time would produce the desired result. As long as the boiling point of the solvent is lower than that of the solute why would lowering the atmospheric pressure help? Just heat the mixture to at or above the solvent boiling point, pulling a vacuum (in the situation where the solvent and solute boiling points lower at the same rate under the same vacuum) would not change the relationship of the solvent boiling point to the solute boiling point. So if terpenes, which is really the crucial element here in terms of being precise, start to boil off at 20 deg Celsius, lets say (that number is from Ed Rosenthal book Beyond Buds), then pulling any vacuum on your solution would immediately start boiling off terps, assuming your working at room temperature. It would seem from this perspective that not pulling a vacuum at all, or working under cool temperatures, would help to preserve those terps, since the solvent in question - in this case butane - will boil off at -1 deg Celsius. See, http://hemphacker.com/what-every-hash-oil-extraction-artist-needs-to-know-about-temperature/ for a little more on what the previous poster and I are referring to. Is this not true? (yes I could check the chart and compare percentage drops in boiling point vs pressures, but would love an actual explanation here) Do the boiling points of terpenes and cannabinoids move down at a different rate than the boiling point of the solvent? Im thinking they don't, but If someone would actually do justice to this question that would be nice, thanks.

          Reply
          1. Dave

            Honestly, it comes down to a safety issue. Arguably, one is safer extracting flammable solvents at lower temps; vacuum extraction provides this (relative) safety.

            Reply
  13. Vin

    Garbage info. All liquids evaporate when you remove all atmospheric pressure. Good thing you can't vac out gravity.....

    Reply
  14. Bulimia Tips For Purging | Stop binge Eating

    […] Vacuum Purging and Processing Tips | Skunk Pharm … – I’m lives at 140 ft above sea level and am going to be doing my first run. I am going to be vac purging in a 5 gal vac chamber and 3 cfm 2 stage pump under a hot … […]

    Reply
  15. John Nolan

    I'm lives at 140 ft above sea level and am going to be doing my first run. I am going to be vac purging in a 5 gal vac chamber and 3 cfm 2 stage pump under a hot plate, my only confusion comes with the pressure I should be purging my oils at. If I run full vac -30hg would all my thc9 and terpens boil out? What pressure should I use and should I leave the pump running the entire time because I believe the unit was made to process oil.

    Reply
  16. dabdealer

    Damm I neec to make some videos and help these people outt watching video of it done online is best and rember CRAP IN CRAP OUT if ur usen shit you will get shit!

    Reply
  17. Cannabis Oil, BHO and stuff.. - Page 2 - BreedBay

    […] to someone that has predispositions against butain as a solvent for extracting cannabinoids.rnrnVacuum Purging and Processing Tips | Skunk Pharm Research LLCrnrnVacuum Equipment and Process Tips | Skunk Pharm Research LLCrnrnVacuum - Wikipedia, the […]

    Reply
  18. Cannabis Oil, BHO and stuff.. - BreedBay

    […] to someone that has predispositions against butain as a solvent for extracting cannabinoids.rnrnVacuum Purging and Processing Tips | Skunk Pharm Research LLCrnrnVacuum Equipment and Process Tips | Skunk Pharm Research LLCrnrnVacuum - Wikipedia, the […]

    Reply
  19. Daron Rude

    Just curious why you guys use "hg measurements rather than mm hg, microns or torr(millitorr) . I find the "hg confusing. What type of gauge are you using that reads "hg? Thx. I am totally new at this, have not tried to do anything yet, am researching before I do anything, but am not new to high vacuum applications.

    Reply
    1. Daron Rude

      and.... what is the level of vacuum needed and how fast do you need to get there? could you talk in microns for me? Is backstreaming really an issue?? I mean we are talking not a lot of molecules here....that could be migrating back and forth. As far as pump ratings.... you guys are aware that these are rated in a perfect world at the outlet...right? ....and never in the amount of time that you would actually want to pull that level. What about diffusion pumps or turbo pumps?? you guys use these?? using stainless manifolds or glass and what type of gauges. Ever consider a rough pump first to pull the initial vapors out and then change over to a higher end finishing pump?? Thanks for answers. :) cheers

      Reply
  20. Pharma Industry In Franklin Square CDP | Pharmaceutical Consulting

    […] Vacuum purging and processing tips | skunk pharm research llc […]

    Reply
  21. vick

    GAST DAA V155 oil less diaphram vacuum compressor. these are rated between 3.2-3.8 cfm and draw down to 25 microns, thinking it would work well along side my 3 gallon chamber any thoughts ? these are apparently used in medical and lab settings. can anyone shed some light on how a diaphram compressors differs from rotary vane ? pros and cons. I currently use a CPS 3 cfm single stage tech-set which works wonders but looking to upgrade to an oil less pump as ive heard they are the way to go

    Reply
    1. skunkpharmresearch

      We've had good luck with a DAA 501 GB in some applications. They will pump some vapors, but are not chemically rated like a Welsh A rotary vane pump rotates a rotor with spring loaded vanes attached to the outside, in an irregular shaped cylinder, so that the spaces are alternately larger to intake and made smaller as it rotates, to discharge. A diaphragm pump works like a piston pump, except it flexes a flexible diaphragm back and forth, so as to compress the space on the other side of it and produce a pumping action in conjunction with check valves. They care less about what goes through them, than a piston pump, because they require no lubrication and the vapors don't foul their crank cases.

      Reply
  22. R3cluse

    My 2 stage, 8cfm yellow jacket pulls down to 15 microns supposedly, but upon buying a digital vacuum gauge i notice most of the time it pulls to right around 80 to 100 if I'm using robinair high temp oil. If i use black gold oil i get down to about 250microns as it seems to break down at higher temps. Even with these losses, my pump oil appears clear. Saying a 1 stage pump will cut it is true, BUT only if the correct oil is used with frequent oil changes (I have to change mine after the initial 4 hour purge where most of the solvent is removed. At this point my maximum vac is around 400 microns :/ and an oil change is always necessary, this is why I use my old oil from last batch no to pull the initial bulk of solvent out before changing the oil that hopefully gets me through the run.) It's scary, the revelations I'm having since incorporating the digital gauge, in reality the oil lubricating the vanes in the pump is the main factor in achievable microns, and i'm pretty sure if I went around checking most people's pumps, they'd be pulling around 1000 microns max, so yeah, get a one or 2 stage pump, but neither is doing the job if you aren't constantly monitoring vacuum with a digital gauge and changing your oil accordingly or incorporating a cold trap beforehand to avoid the issues entirely. In my tests I've found that most pump oils break down at the 4 hour mark of constant pump usage due to temperature reducing the viscocity of the oil. Once the pump is cooled my micron readings go back down close to normal again until the oil is heated again. The running duration is lowered each time, i'm guessing due to degredation of the oil. Robinair High Temperature Vac oil seems to be the most stable.

    Reply
    1. Jake

      What digital vacuum gauge do you recommend? Also would I be better off adding a cold trap to my system between pump and vacuum oven, or is that just used for reclaiming gas?

      Reply
      1. King Solomon Genetics

        You shouldn't need a cold trap, unless you have a complicated close loop system you're trying to run it with.

        Reply
    2. King Solomon Genetics

      I agree and robinair works best for me in the High Rockies, every other oil get diluted and makes my pumps run hot

      Reply
  23. Josh

    What would happen if after the warm bath after extraction when oil has stopped bubbling you only use a vacuum with no extra heat. Would it still take the butan out

    Reply
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