Glycerin Extraction

Kosher vegetable glycerin is an effective method for extracting cannabis concentrates directly from the plant material and produces a tasty medication that is easily ingested directly orally, or mixed with drinks and food.

Glycerin is a heavy, syrupy clear liquid sugar alcohol that has approximately 60% of the sweetness of sucrose, and about the same food value.

It is however not actually a true sugar and is often used as a sugar substitute, as diabetics are often able to use it without experienced the blood sugar rollercoaster they suffer with sucrose or other sugars.

Glycerin makes an extremely tasty and provocative cannabis tincture, that when made using cold extraction methods, is reminiscent of wild honey, as it preserves all the individual flavors, so that they dart off in all directions simultaneously.

Hot glycerin extraction also makes a tasty tincture, with the flavor more resembling a fine soup, where the individual flavors are married into one overall flavor. While not as whimsical and provocative as a cold extraction, it can be prepared start to finish in a couple days, where cold extractions take a minimum of 60 days and are commonly soaked for 120 days or longer.

Many of the provocative flavors and odors from cannabis are aromatic terpenes, and the reason that they are aromatic in the first place, is that they give off molecules at room temperature.

Heating speeds up the rate that the accompanying terpenoids and other aromatics are vaporized off, so many are collateral damage in a hot extraction and are lost.

The glycerin molecule is actually only a three carbon molecule chain, with three hydroxyl groups (OH) attached, and as hydroxyl groups are hydrophilic, glycerin is hygroscopic (absorbs water) and dissolves readily (miscible) in water.

It has a flash point of approximately 177C (351F), and a boiling point of 290 °C (554°F).

It is relatively non toxic. The MSDS tells us that the LD50 Oral rat dosage is 12,600 milligrams per kilogram of body weight, which is approximately 5.7 grams per pound of body weight, or 36 ounces for a 180 pound male.

By comparison, acute oral toxicity (LD50) Oral Rat for sucrose sugar is 29700 mg/kg and about 7060 mg/kg for ethyl (grain) alcohol.

At saturation, Glycerin only hold as 33% as much cannabis oil as the same volume of ethyl (grain) alcohol, so about three times more is required per dose.

To reach maximum saturation however, requires processing more than one batch of fresh material through the glycerin, because as the saturation level increases, the glycerin becomes less aggressive as a solvent and the partially dissolved cannabis boundary layer interface with the solvent is also no longer at full strength and as reactive.

To keep the reaction from slowing to a snails pace, or even stopping, some method must be used to keep removing this stagnant layer and refreshing the boundary between the solvent and resin.

In addition heat dramatically affects resin dissolution rates. The hotter it is, the faster it works, up to the point of overheating.

As glycerin is usually used as an oral med, we also need to consider decarboxylating the cannabinoids so that they are orally active.

If not in excess, some water solubles add to the flavor of a glycerin tincture, and taking all of the water out of the material before processing it, makes it frangible and prone to breaking into small fragments that may be hard to remove.

Let’s look at how these four variables can be manipulated to produce delicious and effective glycerin tinctures.

Drying and decarboxylation:

Plant material is typically dried to around 10/15% water content by weight for smoking and vaporizing purposes, which is low enough to make some delicious glycerin, but for those who prefer less water solubles in their glycerin tincture or wish to decarboxylate the material before extracting, you may add a drying and/or decarboxylation step.

To simply remove most of the remaining moisture, I place the plant material on a cookie sheet in a 200F oven and turn it, until it is frangible when I roll it between my finger and thumb.

At that point it is ready for extraction, but if you also wish to decarboxylate the plant material before making your tincture, you can then crank up the oven to 250F and after it stabilizes at the higher temperature, replace the plant material in the oven and hold it at temperature for approximately 30 minutes

That will add a roasted flavor to the tincture and many of the turpenoids will be lost, but it will decarboxylate approximately 70% of the existing carboxylic acids into their non acid orally active form.

An alternative to decarboxylating the material ahead of time, is to do it after the extraction is complete and the plant material has been filtered out. That eliminates the roasted flavor and preserves more of the turpennoids.

Using Temperature:

Elevating the temperature of the glycerin increases the rate of dissolution of the resins, especially if you raise the temperature high enough for the resins to be molten. THC, CBD and CBN are all molten at just under 180F, so we operate at that temperature.

The advantage of using as low a temperature as possible, is that fewer aromatic terpenoids are boiled off at that low a temperature, and it decarboxylates more slowly, so that the process doesn’t pass the peak of the decarboxylation curve and start down the other side toward low THC and high CBN. As previously noted, we can finish the decarboxylation later.

Keeping the boundary layer removed:

The boundary layer is the layer of partially reacted resin and dilute solvent that forms on the surface of the resin after the initial aggressive dissolution by the solvent. The solvent at that point is dilute, as is the resin concentration, so that the reaction slows or grinds to a halt.

To keep the reaction operating at a reasonable rate, we need to periodically or continuously remove that boundary layer, and there are four methods that I will present here.

The first is to stir. Simply stir gently and thoroughly with a wooden spoon

The second is to shake. Simply shake a jar of glycerin and plant material by hand regularly. A paint shaker would also work for this application.

The third is to tumble. Placing the jar of glycerin and plant material in a rock or photo film tumbler will keep the boundaries fresh. It is an effective and gentle way to speed up the process.

The forth is vibration. Placing jar of glycerin and plant material in a vibratory cartridge case cleaner, or other form of vibration, creates more shear energy that tumbling and will dissolve the material the fastest of any method we have tried thus far.

Material selection and preparation for hot or cold processing:

While glycerin tincture can be made from anything from prime bud to stems, it is tastiest done from prime bud and least tasty with the stems. I usually make glycerin tincture out of the sweet trim removed from the buds during manicuring and popcorn buds.

It is not necessary to grind up the material, only to break it up any buds so that the material is loose enough for the glycerin to reach all the surfaces. Excessive pulverization of the material will result in color and particulate pickup that is difficult to remove. If you leave some surfaces blinded however, the resins on those surfaces won’t be removed either.

Extracting using the cold process:

The cold process is the easiest and tastiest way to make glycerin tincture. We extract using the cold process, simply by soaking the plant material in glycerin at ambient temperatures and agitating it for sixty days or more. Sixty days is about the least amount of time for a cold extraction, and typically they are run 90 to over 120 days. I have one experiment with more than 365 days of soak time.

After the extended soak and agitation, the glycerin is poured off and pressed out of the plant material to yield quality and tasty tinctures. It can also be used with fresh material for another cycle, so as to build up more potency.

There are a number of ways to press out the glycerin from the plant material, and it applies to both cold and hot extraction, so I will cover that in a separate discussion at the end of extraction methods.

The way that we make cold process glycerin tincture, is to load a canning jar 2/3′ds full of plant material, lightly compacted and then cover with glycerin while stirring with a wooden spoon, until every surface is well coated and mixture is homogenous, and then add another inch of glycerin on top.

We place the jars in a cool dark place or cover to exclude light. We sometimes wrap jars with aluminum foil to exclude light.

Every day for the soak period days, we periodically agitate the jars, using one of the above methods and at the end I filter out the plant material for a a light golden to dark amber glycerin tincture, that is tasty and of high quality.

Because the aromatic terpenoids are preserved, it will have many flavors present, interacting and darting off in all directions simultaneously.

You can more easily filter the mixture if you warm it up to 150F or so before filtering.

Potency and gleaning:

As previously noted, to reach maximum saturation, requires processing more than one batch of fresh material through the glycerin, because as the saturation level increases, the glycerin becomes less aggressive as a solvent and the remaining partially dissolved cannabis is also no longer at full strength and as reactive.

In point of fact, the fresh pressed material from the above first cycle will still contain significant cannabinoids, which takes two to three cycles to get it all.

What we do is put the fresh pressed plant material back in the jar and refill with fresh glycerin and add fresh material to the freshly pressed glycerin for another cycle, if I desire more strength.

The fresh glycerin will do the best job of scavenging the remaining cannabinoids, and then can be used again with fresh material to further build up its potency. It is by this cascading technique, that we can leave little behind and yet still maintain quality and potency.

I should note that the most potent glycerin tincture is not necessarily the most tasty, and one cycle produces effective meds, so most of the time we do not bother to bump up the potency with cold tincture.

Hot glycerin extraction:

We prepare plant material and extract cannabis by the hot glycerin extraction process in much the same way as we do by the cold process, though we stir it instead of shaking, tumbling, or vibrating it.

We also use a thermal cycling process and stir regularly, rather than an extended cook as many processes call for. The expansion and contraction of the thermal cycling help break up the resins so that they dissolve more readily.

As with cold tincture, we load a canning jar 2/3′ds full of plant material, lightly compacted and then cover with glycerin while stirring with a wooden spoon, until every surface is well coated and mixture is homogenous, and then add another inch of glycerin on top.

We then set that jar in an electric fondue pot full of hot Canola oil at 200F, and stir it regularly with a wooden spoon until the mixture reaches 180F, and then we adjust the pot temperature controls to maintain 180F.

We stir the mixture regularly with a wooden spoon, for another thirty minutes, and then take it out of the hot oil and allow it to cool to ambient temperature.

For what it’s worth, we use a wooden spoon, because a light tink with a metal spoon against a hot glass jar while stirring, can break it and dump the whole mixture into the hot oil.

After the mixture has cooled to room temperature, we again place into 200F oil and bring it back up to 180F while stirring regularly. When it reaches 180F, after a through stir, we take it out of the hot oil and let it cool to ambient temperature again.

We repeat the last step about five more times and after the last cook and stir; we filter out the plant material while the mixture is still hot.

Filtering glycerin tincture:

Vegetable glycerin is thick and syrupy, so it doesn’t filter quickly or easily without mechanical help. The simplest way to filter it is to heat it up so that it isn’t so viscous, and pour it into a jelly bag, which you wring out by hand. That works, but leaves a lot of glycerin behind and you are limited to temperatures that you can handle with your hands.

A French coffee press, a potato ricer, or a jelly press can also work, and you can buy tincture presses used by the botanical extraction industry.

We made my own press, using a hydraulic bottle jack inside a scrap metal frame, which presses a filter bag between two stainless dog dishes, at a force of 12,000 psi, and catches the glycerin in a third stainless dog dish.

It presses the plant material into a hard little puck, that we have to break up to reprocess.

Flavoring glycerin tincture:

A well made glycerin tincture is a taste delight in its own right, but for those of ya’ll who just like to play, here is how we’ve flavored glycerin that I had already infused with cannabis oil.

We started by adding equal parts of Bing Cherry and Blueberry raisins in a blender with enough 190 proof grain alcohol to make a soupy paste when macerated by the blender.

We tossed in half as much Japanese Gari and a dash of Almond extract, added another half a cup of 190 proof, and let it blend well.

When pureed, we poured it into a stainless mixing cup and placed it in a 180F hot oil bath. We cooked and stirred it until all the alcohol was gone, and then removed it to cool.

We then put a bout two tablespoons of that concentrate into each 1/2 pint of infused glycerin to be flavored and place it in the 180F oil to cook for thirty minutes while stirring regularly.

At that point we remove it from the oil, filter out the concentrate using a filter bag and the glycerin press. The glycerin is delightfully flavored, and the chef gets to eat the concentrate from the filter bag! Ahwooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!! Hee, hee, hee………………..

Above

Hot soak for one week; Hot cycle 7 times;Cold vibrate; Hot cycle and vibrate

Cold Vibrate                                                                               Density samples

Second pressing of material                                                160F cycled 7 times

Cold press 60 days                                                                   Hot versus cold extraction

208 responses to this post.

  1. […] VAPOR! (unless you want to blow yourself up) For VG the proces is described pretty well over here: Glycerin Extraction | Skunk Pharm Research LLC All are concentrates .. that's why I added this to your […]

  2. Posted by Tony on February 28, 2014 at 1:53 PM

    I use a basket type juice extractor to filter all my tinctures and oils. Spin dry! I manage to save every milligram of tincture this way.

  3. […] love to see a walk through of how to get my plants into my e cig, will be keeping an eye out Glycerin Extraction | Skunk Pharm Research LLC Decarbed, it should work in an e-cig. It seems that 'underestimated' is an understatement on the […]

  4. Posted by Zygomaticus on February 23, 2014 at 4:51 AM

    I would like to make a hot glycerin extraction with kief. How much glycerin/gram of kief and how many doses could I get out of one gram of good kief?

    • Glycerin will saturate to around 10/20% and I typically yield about 61% oil from average bubble.

      Assuming 15%:

      1 gram X .61 divided by .15 = ~4 grams glycerin.

      1 gram divided by 5 grams = 20% solution

      .100 gram dose divided by .20 = 500 mg of tincture per dose

      5 grams divided by 500 mg = ~10 doses

      • Posted by Zygomaticus on February 24, 2014 at 10:46 AM

        I am totally confused by this answer. I’m guessing I could get between 5-10 doses depending on strength. I have my glycerin in 2 oz bottles. Should I add 1 gram of kief per ounce of glycerin? What is the fastest and best way to process this? I thought I could just heat it for a while but the process above is so complicated, and the dispensaries where I live don’t have a good selection of tinctures at all so that’s why I want to make my own. I also need it to be as cost effective as possible.

  5. Posted by Philibuster on January 15, 2014 at 6:10 PM

    I have been soaking a small experiment with cold for just over 3 months. A couple of grams with 20 ml of ecig liquid. When i started it i did some research. Im getting ready to pull it out to use by my wedding in a month. Ill leave it in another 3 weeks. One thing i didnt see in my original research didnt say anything about not using pre flavored and nicotine pg/vg. Now ive read stuff about not using that. Did i waste my time?

  6. Posted by crafty toker on January 10, 2014 at 8:20 PM

    Would i have to use a glass jar? Could i cook it in metal? What’s the bud to vg ratio? How will i know when all of the thc is extracted? How much of this extract does it take to medicate? I plan on putting it in e liquid so it will be thinned out and diluted with flavors and such. Do ih have to put the material in the oven at 250 for 30 mins before the hot extraction method? I don’t want to take the extra time to flavor it should I?

    • Stainless works fine.

      Enough VG to cover the material about an inch.

      How much it takes depends heavily on what it is made from. It will typically be saturated 30%/40%.

      It will be partially, to mostly decarboxylated by hot extraction, so you might cook a test sample to see what happens when you heat it to 250/290F. If it froths, it isn’t fully decarboxylated.

  7. Posted by Dean A on January 3, 2014 at 2:20 PM

    Hello & thanks for all of the great info! My question is, can I first do a QWET (frozen) then reduce that down to an oil, reconstitute it with some warm grain alcohol, then add that to the glycerin to make a very potent VG tincture? My goal is to make a very strong VG tinc that can be diluted to load into my ecigs. Can this tincture be made with QWET oil instead of plant material?

  8. Posted by chris on December 28, 2013 at 8:31 PM

    Can you smoke the it after it has been soaked in vg or pg?

  9. Posted by Dave Arnold on December 26, 2013 at 3:24 PM

    Great site. Always my ‘go to’ whenever I start any science project.

    Question: I have two quarts of glycerin that are about 9 months old. It wasn’t made to your specs and could be made stronger, since I have this summers crop sitting in jars getting older by the day. Should I start fresh with new glycerine or can I build on the older batches?

    Either way is fine. I do like the glycerine tincture in my closet of oils and subs. Thanks for the great work.

    Dave

  10. Posted by John on December 24, 2013 at 9:10 PM

    Hi, first of all thank you for taking the time to share this information. Quick question though. I recently did an extraction (thermal cycling) and when I proceeded to the decarboxylating stage the extraction never started bubbling, I had it in a jar in a pot with water on a stove/hot plate. I assume it was at correct temp. Water was hot, but not quite boiling at the beginning, towards the end it was slightly boiling and on the last cycle it was boiling. I was going by the look of the extraction itself during the entire process, which was definitely hot and runny the whole time. It turned dark pretty quick and was black at the end. One thing I forgot to mention is I used 3G vaped and 1g normal (dried) that is why I tried to decarb it to get the last out of the vaped and all of the dried. Sorry for the rant, figured I would provide as much info as possible. Hope to hear back from you. Merry Christmas.

  11. Posted by tinct-tinckering on December 15, 2013 at 10:39 AM

    Can you please explain decarboxilation in the last step of the hot process. Temp and time. I’ve been following this thread for a long time now just being audience. Thanks for all your information and time. I think this is overall healthier and enjoyable way of medicating.

  12. Posted by korupt on December 15, 2013 at 5:49 AM

    Experimenting some more so now I’m back thirsting for knowledge:)

    Vibration seems to be the best thing but would an ultrasonic cleaner work at all? I know it is not exactly the same type of vibration but maybe sound waves can be used to keep boundary layers from forming and help free cannabinoids. Any thoughts on this?

    Is it always best to agitate more or is there some point where it isn’t required any more? I saw that with vibration you used like 10h/week, I got a dremel that turns on every 15 mins and rests for 45. Could agitating to much damage it somehow?

    And my last question is on decarbing. I asked this before but I wanted to check if I understood it right. After I followed the hot process and let it sit for 2-3 weeks, right before I am to bottle my tincture, could I decarb it here? The small tests that I’ve made with VG seems to indicate that I can, as I am able to see the bubbles forming but I’m not sure if there is any disadvantages to this.

    Thanks for the help everyone.

    • Any energy wave that creates an interchange of solvent at the resin interface, would help. I guess it would depend on the sound amplitude and frequency.

      The agitation has to be gentle enough to not break up the material.

      Yes, you can decarb as a last step.

  13. Posted by Mark Miller on December 14, 2013 at 12:29 PM

    I have been reading this stuff all morning.
    I am trying to perfect my oil.
    I am using pure bubble and VG to make it,getting it to around 180f and the hot and cold method.But when all is said and done the is a left over that has not melted down.
    What do you think it is? is it still what I want or is it a by product.It still smell great…
    Can that be melted at a higher temp.Or should I just get rid of it ? Perhaps it needs to cook for a longer period.
    Thought I read somewhere in here to cook for 6hrs the first day then 4 the next and 4the next……..
    Could really use some help here…..

    • Vegetable glycerin isn’t all that good a solvent, so some of it is good stuff that wouldn’t dissolve and some is the cellulose material left over from the trichome stalks and discs. Straight BHO won’t readily dissolve in VG either.

      • Posted by Mark Miller on December 16, 2013 at 8:36 AM

        Thanks for the reply
        I am trying to stay away from PG that is why just VG to melt , I know you folks say 180f is less better if you are not in a hurry ?
        Is PG a better solvoent? If so Ill use it for the last run. Or do you have a better idea?
        What do you think about vacuming the jar while heating?
        I have tried BHO but think it taste very bad.
        What I am getting now taste very good, nice light brown sugar color
        and can be smoke in a E-Cig
        Used some bubble from last yr and not nearly as nice as the fresh stuff a week old. So I would use only the freshest product you have.
        Will send pics if you folks like.

  14. […] process while I wait to need more oil. I heard this was key to achieve maximum potency. Source: Glycerin Extraction Skunk Pharm Research LLC Ill repost in January/February with my update in potency. I need to […]

  15. Posted by Pete B on December 6, 2013 at 11:04 AM

    I plan on using 7.5g of very high grade material with a 2oz 50/50 mix of PG and VG, I am going to decarb the material then mix into the 50/50 mix. Once mixed I plan on putting it into a sealed jar and putting it into a crock pot. I am undecided on using oil or water in the crock pot. How long should the jar sit in the crock pot,? Should I just put on warm, low or high setting? I am then going to filter through a cheese cloth and vape the oil in a vape pen. Does this sound correct. Any advice you can offer with the crock pot would be very helpful. Thanks

    • You need to stir the material frequently and thoroughly to keep the dissolution going.

      Water is hot enough, but I like to use hot oil because PG and VG will absorb water from the steam while you are stirring it.

      I would extract closer to 140/150F to keep the THC to CBN conversion low.

      Never tried a 50/50 mixture, so no idea on time. If you have a 100X microscope, you can tell by looking at the trichome heads.

    • Posted by Jeff F on December 12, 2013 at 9:23 PM

      Hey Pete B….. How did it work out buddy? I plan on using just plane VG for extracting and using PG to blend with the finished product…. I’m curious to know how it worked for ya tho? Let me know.

  16. Possible Solution for dissolving BHO in Glycerin!

    Hi GW,
    I was speaking with Joe on Friday and he told me about the lack of success everyone is having mixing BHO in Glycerin, BHO not being soluble in Glycerin.

    I may have an solution; we also manufacture homogenizers, handheld and bench top. Gas and oil companies use our homogenizers to make oil /water emulsions, via dispersion.

    Here’s a demonstration of our X120 handheld homogenizer:
    http://www.catscientific.com/video-lab-homogenizer-emulsifies-the-immiscible/

    If you think this will work let me know.

    Steve

  17. Posted by Chea on November 23, 2013 at 11:26 PM

    Yo thanks for the teachings! i got one question, can you do the cold method with wax and bho concentrates?

  18. Hi!
    I recently attempted this, but forgot to decarboxylation and I feel like the result is not so potent.

    Is decarboxylation really going to be about 5 times more potent?
    I have to do this but this website – http://www.marijuanagrowershq.com/decarboxylating-cannabis-turning-thca-into-thc/
    They posted results on research of decarboxylation and indicate that on kief the THC level were moving from 4% to 25%.
    Is that the solution?

    I’m also wondering could I use Volcano vaporized product to use in the tincture and consider it’s been decarboxylated ?

    One last question, you refer to re process the material, when you say that you mean the plant material, not the extract? is it possible or recomended to re-use a tincture against new buds to improve it’s potency or is that almost useless?

    Let me know!
    thanks for the post I love how well the concept is explained!
    Thanks

    • What decarboxylation does, is simply convert the THCA carboxylic acid form of THC into its phenol form. It does that by removing the COOH carboxyl group in the form of C02 and water vapor, but doesn’t create the THC, on changes its form.

      Vaporizing decarboxylates on the spot, and most of what is left in the volcano remains, are the heavier cannabinoids, with the higher boiling points. THC is actually one of the lowest.

      • Posted by psamson6 on December 8, 2013 at 7:33 PM

        So what does it mean about the volcano remains? Their THC level are low so transferring them into a tincture will never make it potent?
        I ask because I can make about 5 bags filled with visible vapor. If I used product that I made only 1 bag, was it long enough to transform the THCA state and will there be still THC to worth a tincture?

  19. Posted by Gloria Corke on November 18, 2013 at 10:46 AM

    At what temp and for how long would you decarb a finished product ,had it not been previously decarb’d and is it better to do in a double boiler or just on the stove with a themometer? Someone else made the tincture for me and said it had to be decarbed, this is the first time I am doing it so I am a little confused on how to do it.

  20. Posted by John Bull on November 13, 2013 at 9:34 AM

    Hello again

    Do you have any wonderful ideas about what to do with the glycerined plant remains (apart from continuing to cycle them/sprinkle it on cereal)? I’ve found them still quite potent. Would making a butter extract more THC than what the glycerine has/hasn’t achieved?

    Or, I don’t suppose there is any wash that could be done? I’m presuming any oil produced, from say an ethanol wash, would be nigh on impossible to separate from the glycerine…

    I’ll get my spoon.

  21. Posted by Mike on November 12, 2013 at 2:32 PM

    I am currently making my first tincture with 1/3 cup of veg glycerin 10gs of vaped weed and 1 of fresh I have had in a crock pot for about 2 days and haven’t done any cycling but have stirred it quite a bit. It was brown origanlly but now is very dark black should I try to cycle it still leave it on for another day or just take it off

  22. Posted by ElvenVap on November 8, 2013 at 11:06 AM

    Hi; I just tried my first VG exraction. I decarbed 50g of bud and added 50g of raw dry bud, mixed and ground and added to 250ml VG in a preserving jar; sealed the jar and put into a pressure cooker at max pressure for 3 x 2 hour sessions, stirring before cooling and reheating. I drained the mix and added another 250ml VG before repeating the whole process.
    Result was 210ml of very dark golden liquid that I’m vaping. Can I put more bud into the resultant liquid and reprocess for a stronger result?
    Sublingual isn’t for me, I use Fentanyl there.

  23. Posted by shane on November 1, 2013 at 3:23 PM

    I have cannatonic and diseltonic strains very high in CBD 1:1 ratio. I’m interested in making a CBD concentrate either an oil (hemp oil) to put in vegetable pills or a tincture (glycerin) Im very involved in the medical industry in Colorado but even with all my connections I cannot find what I’m looking for. I would prefer a high CBD medium THC tincture and a high CBD very low THC tincture or oil. Do you know anyone in Colorado that would be willing to trade tinctures/ oils for sweet leaf or fan leaves? Should my CBD specific tincture be made from fan leaves. I contract with edibles companies for my sweet leaf trim but even they don’t have CBD concentrates. Please help! Thank you.

  24. Posted by donmekka on October 11, 2013 at 8:56 PM

    I have a crap load of everclear quick wash can i just add the glycrin and evaporate the alcohol ?

  25. Posted by Author on October 11, 2013 at 6:34 AM

    Hello,
    I have here QWISO how can i make with this the glycerin elixir, what dosage I should try, and heating or not ?

    Thanks!

  26. Thanks for the great info! I had a few questions. First, is a hot extraction more potent than a say 2 month cold extraction? I have some herbs sitting in glycerin for a few weeks now but if a hot extraction is more potent I may want to use whats been sitting there for a few weeks and do a hot extraction especially since I am getting impatient and dont care as much about taste as potency… Is this OK to do a hot extraction of material that has already been sitting? Any tips? Also heard about adding orange oil to increase potency…is this true?

    • A hot extraction will usually be more potent, but less fanciful from a flavor standpoint.

      • Posted by Lizzy on October 20, 2013 at 4:18 PM

        I use the hot extraction method putting medicine and glycerin into a crock pot and fill it with water to the top it cooks off the green flavor and after 3 days I strain it. I cook for 2 more days and it comes out to a nice honey consistency and sweet flavor.

  27. Posted by loveAndTolerabce on October 10, 2013 at 6:35 AM

    Hello skunk pharm !

    I can’t choose between oil and glycerin exxtraction for my first batch.
    What are the advantages/disavantages of glycerin and oil extractions ?

    which one do you prefer ?

    thanks in advance, you re the best !

    • Are you using as a sublingual, or for medibles?

      • Posted by loveAndTolerabce on October 13, 2013 at 3:36 PM

        both !

        But, actually my question is more about sublingal way.
        Does glycerin works as an edible anyway ? I ve heard that for potent medibles fats are compulsory.

        However I am very interested in sublingual way as an instant medecine, and I can’t decide beetween coconut oil and glycerin

  28. Posted by Rezman on October 9, 2013 at 11:47 PM

    Hi, Thanks for this great info! I was wondering what is more potent, the hot or cold method? I have heard that a hot extraction loses potency over time (as little as 2 weeks) but a cold extract gains potency with time is this true?

    I have also heard that adding pure orange oil can increase thc potency? Would you recommend maybe adding some drops of orange oil?

    I just started two weeks ago with a cold extraction, but I dont think I want to wait another 4-6 weeks, especially if a hot extraction is more potent. Would I mess it up if I took whats been there for a few weeks soaking in glycerin and did a hot extract?

    Thanks!

    • The hot is usually more potent and the cold tastier. Orange juice might drop the Ph and draw more polar elements.

      You can mix and match the cold and hot extraction techniques.

      • Not OJ, but D-Limonene is actually what I hear to combine with a tincture/extract to increase potency. Orange oil is 90% D-Limonene. TetraLabs makes their PureGold with 5% d-limonene, so I figure a few drops of Organic orange oil may increase potency and add a nice flavor? Does something with the terpenes. I haven’t done extensive research on this so let me know what you think…may be beneficial to this recipe.

        • Posted by ElvenVap on November 8, 2013 at 10:45 AM

          I added some finely grated dried orange zest to my hot mix, the flavour came through as it should.

  29. Posted by Trevor on October 6, 2013 at 6:03 PM

    I have a Soxhlet extractor that I currently use with 95% ethanol, but I am really interested in doing hot extractions with glycerine. Would glycerine work in a Soxhlet extractor or is it’s boiling point and viscosity too high for this application?

  30. Great post! One question… I will be using Ball brand glass pint canning jars to make cold extractions. How can I use a vibratory cartridge case cleaner to shake the jars safely?

  31. Posted by Jae on October 3, 2013 at 1:19 PM

    Hey GW,

    For the material polishing unit method, you say you ran it for a week, did you literally leave it on for a week or did you cycle it for say 6hrs a day every day for a week.

    Also if i wanted a stronger extract after that method am I correct in thinking that I need to decarb it in a hot oil bath 250f for 25mins?

    Thanks for all the research

  32. Posted by Yvette on September 12, 2013 at 6:37 PM

    I hit the jackpot finding this blog – awesome detailed information! This is invaluable for someone like me who’s just starting to experiment. What is the shelf life of glycerin extracts?

  33. Posted by Josh B on September 5, 2013 at 3:05 PM

    WARNING !

    Yesterday I accidentally let some of the tinc hit the back of my throat and a drop or 2 hit my wind pipe , it was horrible to say the least , I could not talk or breath any more then the shortest of breaths for about 20mins .. and it induced the worst coughing fit I’ve ever had ..

    I love the Tinc , but it’s best ingested in the mouth/under the tongue , not down the wind pipe .LoL

  34. Posted by Josh B on September 4, 2013 at 2:53 PM

    When you ingest glycerin tincture should it be placed under the tongue and held there for a moment , or just swallowed ?

    &

    At what temp and for how long would you decarb a finished product ,had it not been previously decarb’d ?

    I made a pint that I let sit for 100 days , used some UKcheese and LemonLarryOGkush ,used cured dry bud ground up by hand . Because I did not decarb the material prior to the soak , after I filtered it thru a piece of silk screen I heated it up to around 200deg’s for an hour .. the taste of this stuff is absolutely AMAZING . I did heat a small bit for awhile longer and maybe 20~30deg’s higher and it came out with more of a “soup” type taste , I can not tell any noticeable difference in potency between the 2 ,but I enjoy the more “candied” flavor vs. the more foody soupy flavor

    Thank you GW & SPR for sharing all the info and the help

    • The cannabinoids are transdermal. Uptake is faster if you roll the glycerin around and coat the inside of your mouth with it, especially under the tongue where there are lots of blood vessels.

      Glycerin boils at 544F, so you can heat a glycerin extraction to 250F for ~about 30 minutes to decarboxylate.

      I like the taste of the cold extraction better too and the more floral the starting material, the better.

      • Posted by glaucomic wino on September 8, 2013 at 6:20 PM

        I have heard glycerin is used to make red wine bolder. It is added during bottling. Have you experimented with this at all? I’m worried about the oil from the extraction. Could you comment on the chemical process between the glycerin and the cannibinoids? Is the cannibus oil suspended in the tincture or does it break down?

  35. Posted by nope nope on August 27, 2013 at 12:12 AM

    How would one take a ethol tincture and convert it to VG?

  36. Posted by CuriousGeorge on July 20, 2013 at 9:41 AM

    Do you think this could be used to make the juice/liquid for e cigs? I guess that they are just mixing glycerin, nicotine, and flavoring used for baking. It seems like it would work, what are your thoughts?

  37. Posted by heliotropic on July 19, 2013 at 4:07 PM

    ok more questions:

    I am trying out the hot method, but am slightly confused when it comes to the amount of times you “bathe” the mixture and the whole gleaming and potency part of the article. I understand as the more the glycerin absorbs the less effective it is at absorbing so you need to add both more fresh mat. and more glycerin, but when do you add more? Do you do your first bath let it cool down then add more fresh or do you bathe the mixture 7 times then add more fresh and repeat the process, or did i just not understand the concept at all? Also is there a maximum amount of times you can bathe the glycerin (as long as you maintain below 180f)? Will it start to lose potency at a point?

    Also do you have anymore good tips on flavoring the ticture? Could I use something like peppermint essential oil or orange essential oil?

    • You process one batch seven times, filter, and then add new material for 7 more rounds.

      That is probably about as potent as you will be able to get it, as glycerin is more limited than solvents like alcohol or oil, in how much it can hold in solution.

      The extract will get less heady and more sedative with continued cycling, as more THC is converted to CBN.

      Yeah, check out http://www.lorannoils.com/ for a plethora of flavor possibilities.

  38. Posted by Bryce Limber on July 14, 2013 at 7:30 PM

    hey what did you use for the box again?

  39. Posted by heliotropic on July 12, 2013 at 6:58 PM

    when making the cold press tincture do you heat the canning jar to seal it like you would when you normally can something?

  40. Posted by Jim on June 8, 2013 at 11:14 AM

    Well, well, well…….. Attended the Oil and glycerin extraction class yesterday and what a success it was!
    First and foremost Thank You to the Hostess! Such and warm and welcoming atmosphere. Thank You as well to GW for running the class, such knowledge!

    Figured the class might be three or four hours, I spent nearly eight hours with this wise and friendly crew. Took lots of notes and soon I will be sifting through and rearranging my newly acquired knowledge. Not only were three different extractions being prepared out at the shack, but numerous treats and a lunch !!! were created in the kitchen. What a great experience ! Just an extremely uplifting experience followed by an early summer evening dining with close friends in the city.
    Cheers to Skunk Pharm Research and as always…….Safe Travels…….Jim

  41. Posted by Dubologist on May 31, 2013 at 7:48 PM

    GeeDub, Just want to say thank you for your continued research. SPRs work efforts will to continue to educate patients who seek alternative treatments.

    We have attempted to combine a finely purged BHO with pure VG mimicking your “hot extraction” technique. The end goal would be for e-cig cartridge use. I was hoping to avoid using a premade PG/VG (already purchased VG before i found 50/50 mix lol).

    Failed method: Heated both oils in small pyrex cylinder @ 180. Stir. Repeat.
    Result- Yellowish VG which had no potency when vaped, Volume of oil extract remained the same once cooled and bonded.

    So, my question is how come you can use VG to extract @180 from dry goods but cant do the same with just an oil? If VG acts as a solvent with dry goods @180 then why not break down the same oil and bond with it to have a potent VG mix? Maybe because the VG has 30% saturation level or something… have read so much everything is starting to blend…

    Any insight would be mucho appreciated.

    Your loyal students-EAST COAST

    • Yeah, doesn’t work well at all. Glycerin is not a very good solvent to start with and is highly polar compared to butane.
      I’ve even dissolved it in alcohol, before mixing with glycerin and cooking off the alcohol, only to have it separate.

      • Posted by korupt on November 19, 2013 at 12:58 AM

        Not sure I follow:/ So you cant at all achieve the same tincture strength with BHO as with raw material?

        If I do it fully according to your hot process, will it still not dissolve? Should I drop my BHO–>VG Tincture ideas or is there some method we can fully mix them both.

        If there is a method to get a nice VG tincture from BHO, what would the process be?

        Best regards
        k

        • The issue isn’t that you can’t get the same tincture strength using BHO to infuse vegetable glycerin, but that all of the constitutes that dissolve in butane, won’t dissolve in vegetable glycerin, so it leaves behind globs of undissolved material, that is hard to filter out without freezing.

          We have an emulsifier en-route, to see if that will mix the two, but so far the best vegetable tinctures we’ve made, are using the VG to extract with in the first place.

          • Posted by korupt on November 27, 2013 at 4:56 AM

            Great and educating answers as always. Right now I’m waiting on my hot extraction tincture from BHO absolute (2.5g absolute and 25ml VG), exciting to see how it hits. My next project will def be a tincture extracted from hash right away to see how that plays out.

            I’ve done the 5 step hot extraction process and I’ve put the tincture in a small bottle glued to a fan so “I” can stir it without being there. Idea is that it should be shaken/stirred for 2 weeks then I’ll try and see how it is. And now comes the question harassment…sorry:/

            Do you recommend processing it more than those two weeks and if so how?

            During the 2 weeks stir the tincture will have about 35-40 deg Celsius due to a hot exhaust fan. Is this something good or bad? I thought that maybe the warm air could help the extraction and I don’t think there is much/any decarb happening at those temperatures.

            Last question is can I decarb the tincture instead of decarbing the material? I’d like to save decarbing as the last process of it all so that I can control the heady/body high a bit better.

            Thank you for a wonderful compendium of compelling information:)

          • 30/40C isn’t really that hot, so although some decarboxylation will occur, it won’t be profound. Check out the graph in the decarb section, where I just changed the graph.

            Extraction also will be slow at that temperature, so I typically use 60 days minimum for a cold extraction.

            Yes, you can decarb afterwards, and is how we do it.

  42. Posted by Seth on May 28, 2013 at 9:16 PM

    how dramatic is the difference between a 7 day / 30 day / 60 day / etc.? is the cold method usable without decarboxylating or do you still have to do that?

    • It is hard to achieve the same potency using the cold method, but it tastes more like wild honey, with all the individual flavors going off in all directions, while the hot method tastes more like a soup of all the flavors.

      Less than a 90 day cold soak makes a relatively weak tincture, so we typically do it 120 days or longer.

      You can use the cold method without decarboxylation, but it won’t be as potent. If you wait long enough, the oil will decarboxylate naturally in the sugar alcohol (vegetable glycerin).

      Don’t have a HPLC, so not sure exactly how long that takes.

  43. Posted by Rob on May 27, 2013 at 7:54 PM

    “An alternative to decarboxylating the material ahead of time, is to do it after the extraction is complete and the plant material has been filtered out. That eliminates the roasted flavor and preserves more of the turpennoids.”

    first, thank you for all of the info on your site…just wonderful

    second, can you please cover how to decarb after filtering out the plant matter? im not sure if i can get it hot enough in the oil bath, or what time/temp i’m shooting for here…or do i stick the jar of filtered glycerin in the oven @ 250 for half hour?

  44. Posted by marcos on May 19, 2013 at 12:42 AM

    So… in the event that a slight tink does break the jar while in the oil releasing the mixture into the hot oil… is it all lost at that point? Any way to recover?

    • I’ve made tincture out of it.

      • Posted by marcos on May 20, 2013 at 9:28 AM

        Could you tell me how to go about it? I have a potfull of oil glycerin and bud awaiting rescue or disposal… how can I salvage this?
        Also, thanks for responding and for upkeeping such an informative and awesome site

        • Mix the gawd awful mess with equal parts hexane and shake well. Place in a separatory funnel, and allow to stratify, before bleeding off the glycerin and emulsion. Check the Hexane for clarity.

          If it still isn’t clear, add an equal part of water saturated with salt and shake again, before allowing to stratify in a separatory funnel.

          Decant the water and repeat as necessary, until the water rinse under the hexane is clean.

          Bleed off the water, evaporate off the hexane, and voille!

  45. Posted by Brody on May 13, 2013 at 9:13 AM

    Thank you for posting and please keep up the good work! Plenty of healthy lives depend on natural meds and happiness is plentiful for it!

  46. Posted by Demonicdaron on May 9, 2013 at 6:56 PM

    First of all, I would like to thank you for the incredibly useful info you gave us; this is the best website I’ve found till now.

    I have tried the hot extraction following your guide. I used prime buds and a 70%PV 30%PG mixture, as I will use the extract for vaporizing in an eCig.

    I couldn’t get a very steady temp as I used my kitchen hobs, which only have 6 determined levels. I was lucky as the first level of my hob warms up the oil up to about 200°F. This temp allowed me to bring the jar up to 180°F. When it reached 180 I lifted the jar for few seconds and put back in, and repeated this for the whole stirring process.
    I was able to keep the temp between 175-185°F this way.

    I had the same temp issue for the decarb. I managed to maintain the temp at 230-250°F for about 25 minutes (I estimated the time based on the amazing decarb curve you have on the website and the temp I could get). I also based the time on the rate of bubbles as you suggested.
    [I am using an electronic CHEAP cooking thermometer that works well but takes a bit to set to final temp]

    The final product I got has a nice golden color even though is cloudy. I suppose the cloudyness is given from the fact that I filtered using a piece of a t-shirt (I pressed it with a “DIY press” (nothing to do with yours :D). It has a full-bodied smell/taste of the prime buds I used.

    I use this extract in my Innokin iTaste vv eCig, and it produces a nice amount of smoke which you can’t even feel in your throat, but taste very good :)

    I wanted to replace spliffs with the eCig using this extract, but I only get a very light buzz with the extract I made.

    You reckon this is due to the temp issue I had?

    Is there any way I can make the extract any stronger? I also thought about “melting/solving” some ISO extract in the Glycerine extrac, but I am not sure if thats possible.

    I would also like to show you a picture of the product I got so you can give me your opinion on it, if you want to :) But I’m not sure how to post them.

    Thanks again for the amazing guide!

  47. Posted by jay vogt on March 4, 2013 at 10:00 AM

    how does the glycerine extractions compare to ever clear(alcohol ) extraction ( described by rick simmons) for creating a medicine for treating cancers ?

  48. Posted by CapnDaft on March 3, 2013 at 4:43 PM

    First off….. I’m sitting here soaking this site in…. it’s magical. Thank you for all your information GW

    1. Can I combine a qwet extraction for potency and then add that extraction to VG…. let it sit for a month and shake it every day?

    2. I mainly medicate for sciatica pain….. It’s not terrible that I need to be rocked right away. So i’m looking for an enjoyable way to do this over a 1/2 hour period…..

    3. The flavouring and tincture making is what peaked my interest in this process…. also that it can retain a ton of original flavour and smoothness as well…… so this combined with a decently potent product….. from a good ecig is what i’m looking for.

    Kind of like a conisseur quality, semi-potent, smooth, tasty, potentially flavoured, completely portable, long lasting, e-cig tincture!

    Any help you can provide is of course appreciated as i’m sure you have a busy life helping all of us out!

    Thanks

    Capn

    • Alas, a QWET extraction won’t readily mix with vegetable glycerin. It leaves undissolved floaters that are difficult to remove.

      GW

      • Posted by CapnDaft on March 8, 2013 at 3:02 PM

        Hi Gray… thanks for the response. I’ve done more research and have determined that the best way for me personally to make a great vg tincture is to make it with bubble hash.

        Questions:

        1. After making bubble hash should I wait for it to cure/dry or just make the bubble and bring that product to the next station to add to vg?

        2. Would I decarb in the oven before adding it to vg (180 at an hour or so?) or should I add it to vg and then put everything in the oven….

        3. The Bubble should fully melt into the vg correct? I should not need to strain it or anything and can bottle it once its done?

        4. I will be using the final product in an ecig type setup… it will be mixed with a little everclear and water to produce a viscosity that has be shown to work in ecigs…… as well as add flavor….. which is the main goal to have a potent cherry cola type vapor!

        If you have any thoughts on the above process I would greatly appreciate your feedback. I would like to make the best damn product I can, and certainly have the time and patience to wait a few months for the vg tinc to mature into all of it’s glory.

        Thanks and have a great day

        Capn

        • Yes, glycerin is hydroscopic, so you want to limit its access to water.

          VG is polar, so it won’t improve dissolution rates to decarb, and it is easier to tell exactly where you are at, if you decarb after extraction.

          The kif won’t completely dissolve, as the shafts are cellulose. I suggest a jelly press, or a potato ricer with some bedsheet for filtration.

          It will be interesting to hear how your e-cig mix works. I made flavored glycerin by cooking dried and maccerated cherries and blueberries pulp in already infused VG. Never tried to vaporize any, but it made a tasty sublingual.

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 10, 2013 at 3:00 PM

            Thanks for the help. I will for sure update you on my progress.

            I still need clarification on a few things…….

            1. If I was to dry the bubble for 24 hrs…..then add it to the vg…then put it in the oven or crockpot to simmer as per you’re methods….. would that be ok as I’m assuming the water would boil off?

            2. What would be the best temp and time for the oven / crockpot to produce a good quality product in preparation to be cooled and let to sit for a period of time? Would decarb be achieved?

            3. Would 2 months, with daily aggitation, get me off to a good start?

            4. You mentioned that the “keif” needs to be pressed out. With bubble…. and the heat initially being applied….along with the cold soak for a few months….. would it not dissolve? I thought bubble hash would be completely soluble by then……

            5. The end of my recipe calls for the addition of some everclear to help thin the mixture out a little bit. Would this dissolve the remaining bits after a 2 month soak? Thus eliminating the filtering process?

            Thank you so much for your time. I would absolutely attend your classes if I lived closer…. I just don’t have the means right now. The information and feedback you have given me has helped a lot so far. Furthering my understanding into this endeavour!

            Have a great night and look forward to hearing from you!

            Capn

          • Thanks for the help. I will for sure update you on my progress.

            I still need clarification on a few things…….

            1. If I was to dry the bubble for 24 hrs…..then add it to the vg…then put it in the oven or crockpot to simmer as per you’re methods….. would that be ok as I’m assuming the water would boil off?

            If you finely divide the bubble and spread it on a screen for 24 hours at ambient temperatures, it is probably dry enough.
            Water doesn’t boil until 212F, and its azeotropes with VG even higher. Better to keep it out in the first place.

            2. What would be the best temp and time for the oven / crockpot to produce a good quality product in preparation to be cooled and let to sit for a period of time? Would decarb be achieved?

            If I understand the question, you would like to decarboxylate the bubble before extraction, and then use a long slow extraction. If that is the case, I would preheat the oven to 144C/292F, and stick the bubble in it for seven minutes.

            3. Would 2 months, with daily agitation, get me off to a good start?

            A 60 day cold soak with agitation will produce a nice glycerin tincture.

            4. You mentioned that the “keif” needs to be pressed out. With bubble…. and the heat initially being applied….along with the cold soak for a few months….. would it not dissolve? I thought bubble hash would be completely soluble by then……

            Some bubble aficionados would have you believe that, but it isn’t true. There is a lot of residue left from full dome melt bubble, it is just typically reduced to a light grey ash when incinerated.
            None of the stalks or hairs dissolve, and are left behind on the filter.

            5. The end of my recipe calls for the addition of some everclear to help thin the mixture out a little bit. Would this dissolve the remaining bits after a 2 month soak? Thus eliminating the filtering process?

            No, because cellulose isn’t soluble in alcohol either.

            Thank you so much for your time. I would absolutely attend your classes if I lived closer…. I just don’t have the means right now. The information and feedback you have given me has helped a lot so far. Furthering my understanding into this endeavour!

            Have a great night and look forward to hearing from you!
            Capn

            Thanks for your good thoughts and I hope that helps!
            GW

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 11, 2013 at 11:14 AM

            Thanks so much for the information. This has answered all my concerns with the exception of 1.

            The 2nd question I asked with regards to heating….

            I should be more clear. I was wondering what the cooking temp and time should be if I wanted to take my now 24 hrs dry bubble, add it to glycerin, and then in the oven to help the process.

            This would then decarb the thc and hopefully allow for the hash to melt into the glycerin I was thinking.

            Or would I be better of with a straight cold extraction?

            Also…. if I went cold extraction…. I assume the decarb is done at the end in order to reduce a toasted flavor? Any other reasons?

            I guess I’m looking to gain as much knowledge as I can in order to get the best possible product. Good potency and flavour. Just not sure if hot or cold has a different effect on the bubble/ final product.

            I know that was long but thanks for helping again….. have a great afternoon!

            Capn

          • It will partially decarb the oil, during hot extraction, but not completely.

            If you decarb beforehand, you end up with a more highly sedative medication, if you then use a hot extraction and convert the THC to CBN.

            I prefer to decarb afterwards, so I know where I’m at, from watching the bubbles.

            Decarb isn’t done afterwards with cold extractions, so much as to reduce the toasted flavor, as to preserve the individual terpene flavors. A cold extraction is tastier all around than a hot extract, especially before it is decarboxylated..

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 12, 2013 at 12:27 PM

            Ok. That mostly makes sense to me. I guess the one thing I’m thinking about the most is to make sure my thc is activated.

            I will be using the tincture in an reosmod mini unit with an atomiser. I understand that the temps in these only get up to 160 degrees or so. This is good cause I don’t want to get glycerin to its flash point…. but I know this is on the lower end for thc.

            So if I was to do a cold extraction…. I would have to decarb the hash in the oven @ 150-170 for 7 minutes, remove from oven, add glycerin, then shelf and shake for 2 months? I’m pretty sure this is the only way I can make an activated and potent cold method tincture.

            If I go hot…..

            (Should I still decarb the hash first or let the process do it?…. even though you said it wont fully decarb in the hot glycerin)

            Decarb at 150-170 for 7 mins, add to glycerin and put in oven for 2 hours @ 170?

            Then jar and store/shake for 2 months.

            The rest I can figure out for the ecig….. I just want my base hash tincture to be done right the first time!

            Your help is greatly appreciated!

            Chris

          • Ok. That mostly makes sense to me. I guess the one thing I’m thinking about the most is to make sure my thc is activated.
            I will be using the tincture in an reosmod mini unit with an atomiser. I understand that the temps in these only get up to 160 degrees or so. This is good cause I don’t want to get glycerin to its flash point…. but I know this is on the lower end for thc.

            Only about THC’s molten point, not close to vapor point. It is the glycerin menstruum that makes such a system work.

            So if I was to do a cold extraction…. I would have to decarb the hash in the oven @ 150-170 for 7 minutes, remove from oven, add glycerin, then shelf and shake for 2 months? I’m pretty sure this is the only way I can make an activated and potent cold method tincture.

            I would suggest 252F for 27 minutes or 292F for 7 minutes.

            If I go hot…..
            (Should I still decarb the hash first or let the process do it?…. even though you said it wont fully decarb in the hot glycerin)

            Decarbing first and then using hot extraction, will make some sedative meds.

            Decarb at 150-170 for 7 mins, add to glycerin and put in oven for 2 hours @ 170?

            Check out the decarboxylation graph at http://skunkpharmresearch.com/decarboxylation/

            Then jar and store/shake for 2 months.
            The rest I can figure out for the ecig….. I just want my base hash tincture to be done right the first time!
            Your help is greatly appreciated!
            Chris

            Peace, GW

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 15, 2013 at 6:04 PM

            Wow… what a great graph. I’m not sure how I missed that one. Now I have a pretty good idea of how I’m going to do this…. thanks to your help of course…..

            I certainly appreciate you taking the time out of your day to help me with all my questions…. I feel fortunate to have found someone I can have a serious conversation about this with!

            Oh I almost forgot….. I meant to ask you last time….. when you do a cold vg run….. you said that you decarb after. Would you put the entire jar in your oil bath at one of the temps you mentioned for the advised time…. then strain the mixture one final time while its warm? Is this the appropriate time for the 25u syringe filter?

            I ask cause you said the walls/stocks are cellulose and that they are not soluble….. just making sure I don’t miss this seemingly crucial last step.

            I don’t need it to be super sedative…. I like the heady feel but like to end up with a sedative type feel. Mostly used in the evening a few hours before bed.

            Maybe heat the vg mix (crock on keep warm for 30 min) a little before the “cold” extraction…2 month sit….. then decarb as you do and filter to finish it off…. end up with a 60/40 head-body high….. and about 8oz of finished tincture from however much bubble hash I get out of an ounce.(hopefully 4-5g)

            Does 1 cup of vg/4g hash seem ok? More/less?

            Wow. That was longer then anticipated! Hopefully you have some opinions to share…. as I would love to hear them!

            Good evening,

            Capn

          • Wow… what a great graph. I’m not sure how I missed that one. Now I have a pretty good idea of how I’m going to do this…. thanks to your help of course…..
            I certainly appreciate you taking the time out of your day to help me with all my questions…. I feel fortunate to have found someone I can have a serious conversation about this with!

            Thanks for the good thoughts bro!

            Oh I almost forgot….. I meant to ask you last time….. when you do a cold vg run….. you said that you decarb after. Would you put the entire jar in your oil bath at one of the temps you mentioned for the advised time…. then strain the mixture one final time while its warm? Is this the appropriate time for the 25u syringe filter?

            No, a jelly bag type filter works best. We make our own out of 200 thread count bed sheets and press them in a hydraulic press of our own design, but a standard jelly press or a potato ricer will work.

            I ask cause you said the walls/stocks are cellulose and that they are not soluble….. just making sure I don’t miss this seemingly crucial last step.
            I don’t need it to be super sedative…. I like the heady feel but like to end up with a sedative type feel. Mostly used in the evening a few hours before bed.
            Maybe heat the vg mix (crock on keep warm for 30 min) a little before the “cold” extraction…2 month sit….. then decarb as you do and filter to finish it off…. end up with a 60/40 head-body high….. and about 8oz of finished tincture from however much bubble hash I get out of an ounce.(hopefully 4-5g)
            Does 1 cup of vg/4g hash seem ok? More/less?

            I would cover the hash with an inch or two of VG, after stirring it in well.

            Wow. That was longer then anticipated! Hopefully you have some opinions to share…. as I would love to hear them!
            Good evening,
            Capn

            Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!!!!!!1 GW

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 16, 2013 at 10:45 AM

            Morning GW!

            Yah I can understand the being “buried” thing. Been busy up my way as well….. work is work no matter where you are!

            The only thing I was still unsure about is the Cold vg decarb. I’ll list the couple questions I have…

            1. Would a little heat at the start aid in the process? Maybe a crock pot on “low or keep warm” setting for 30 mins to help everything get up to temperature and allow the hash to initially absorb better?

            2. After 2 months of sitting, do you decarb by putting the jar in the oven/pot of oil for the times/temps in the graph?

            3. Do you filter the mixture before or after you decarb? I have a french press laying around….. I’ve heard this would work as well?

            Here’s my plan thus far:

            1. Make Bubble Hash with Bubble bags. Take all hash from the 120u and under screens, then mix it together create the final product. Let it dry for 24 hours.

            2. Now that I have some dry hash, I take about 1 cup of vg and add the hash to it. making sure that the hash is completely covered.

            3. I would apply a little heat via crock pot on low….. to aid the hash melting and settling into the vg mix. This will be done for 30 mins and not letting the temp go past 170.

            4. Remove the mix from the crock pot, place it in a jar, put the lid on once it’s cooled a little, and store in a dark warm place for 2 months….. shaking as often as I can.

            5. Depending on what you responded to the above questions…….

            > WordPress.com >

          • 1. Would a little heat at the start aid in the process? Maybe a crock pot on “low or keep warm” setting for 30 mins to help everything get up to temperature and allow the hash to initially absorb better?

            It extracts faster warm than cold.

            2. After 2 months of sitting, do you decarb by putting the jar in the oven/pot of oil for the times/temps in the graph?

            Approximately, but I control by watching the bubble formation.

            3. Do you filter the mixture before or after you decarb? I have a french press laying around….. I’ve heard this would work as well?

            Before. A French press might work somewhat, but doesn’t generate the pressure a jelly press or potato ricer does.

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 17, 2013 at 8:21 PM

            Excellent. Thank you for this help! Its getting harder to find people who will take time out of their day to do so anymore……. lots are busy and others wont!

            After reading through my notes, I realized I ha e asked you some questions twice or you have already answered. I apologize if it seemed I was not reading it seriously…. but I really just didnt grasp the concept. Slowing improving I hope!

            The only thing I didn’t consider until reading your response is asking you about the decarb setup. After you have filtered the material….. do you put the jar in the oven/fondue oil pot and watch the bubbles…… or would you pour the mix into a shallow pan/Pyrex dish to see bubbles better?

            That’s all I can think of for now. Have a great day.

            CapnDaft

          • I place the open jar of glycerin tincture into a pot of warm Canola oil, and turn the temperature up to 250F, while stirring regularly. You could also do the same thing in a shallow dish in a oven, which would make it easer to tell exactly where you are, assuming you have a windowed door and oven lights.

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 12, 2013 at 12:30 PM

            I forgot to ask… what did you mean when you said you like to “watch it bubble” when you decarb afterwards….. and is this decarb for a hot extraction or cold that you do.

          • When I watch the bubbles, I note what type of bubbles are being produced and the rate of production. CO2 bubbles are fizzy and of uniform size. Their production rate sharply drops off at about 70% decarboxylation, which is where the rate of conversion from THCA to THC, starts to fall below the rate of conversion of THC to CBN.

            If I want to preserve maximum THC content, I remove it at that point, and if I want to enhance the sedative properties, wait until bubble production stops dead.

          • Posted by Chris Quinn on March 14, 2013 at 5:18 PM

            Great! Ill add this to my notes regarding decarb. Thanks.

            Did you happen to review the other email and the questions I had for you?

            Its the last bit of information I need to give it a try…. so I’m eager yo get started!

            Chris

          • Sorry Chris, when I get buried, I sometimes answer the quick ones first and get to the more involved ones. I think I have done it by now, but if I’m still missing one, please let me know.

            GW

    • Posted by brooke on March 4, 2013 at 1:38 PM

      After trying the veg glycerin in e ecigs I would have say it is not the answer for vapor of mj. It clumps and seperates no matter how long you aggitate the mix for. Plus glycol is really the best thing to vapor with.

  49. Posted by Brooke on February 12, 2013 at 12:58 AM

    Hi there! I have been working with my chemist friend on trying to come up with a healthy and clean smoke to put into e pen and also for dabs we have done hexane, glycerin, bho and ethanol but are having a hard time finding the right consistency for the mix that tastes right. I have read glycerin tincture can be mixed down to the right dilution fairly easy but we now how to make great hexane and ethanol extracts already. Trying to brake away from bho. Do you have any advice? Your page is really nice by the way!

    • I thin my oil with a little 190 proof ethanol to use in a pen. Works good.

      • Posted by Brooke on February 12, 2013 at 12:36 PM

        So we have been making the hexane honey oil and then trying to add alcohol, glycerin and PG to get the right consistency for epens. The hexane wash seems like a purer way to extract large quantities. But we are having problems with adding the PG/ VG combining at the end between flavor and consistency. DO you recommend these additives for a good smoke or just diluting with alcohol?Alcohol seems to burn quickly and not produce enough bulk? Thanks!

        • I haven’t had any success with VG blending. I never tried any of the other glycols so I dont have any experience to speak from.I found just thinning a little with ethanol worked in keeping a high concentration at a workable consistency. The viscosity needed to work good in pens varies by brand and model. Its also quicker and easier than blending with other liquids. Just from personal experience.

          • So you thin wax(s) with the ethanol? I’m trying to figure how to utilize thicker bho in a tank style (wick to element) ecig and believe this is what you’re referring to..?
            Great site!! I absolutely love it and it has exponential improved my weed geek!

          • You can thin it with ethanol or decarboxylate it to make it flow better.

            Thanks for the good thoughts and pleased that you’ve gotten good use out of our site!

  50. Posted by Orion on February 9, 2013 at 8:04 AM

    So I am getting this right when I say the process for hot extraction goes as follows:

    - Heating the mixture to 180 F takes approx 30 mins
    - It should be stirred for another 30 mins
    - It should then be cooled to ambient temperature
    - These three steps should be repeated six more times

    ?

    Three other questions:

    - How long does it typically take for the mixture to cool to ambient temperature?
    - I am using a 14 gram kief puck in 2.75 oz glycerin, is there any changes that I should make to the process due to the quantity I am using or the fact that it is solely kief?
    - I will be consistently stirring the mixture with a magnetic stirrer, does this affect the time that I should leave the mixture to heat?

    Thank you very much! Your article is very clear and concise.

  51. Posted by Stephen on February 4, 2013 at 3:35 PM

    I see that makes sense my returns are good I was just hopin I could use the reamaing trichrome with a batch of butter. Thank u for ur response tho ur awesome, I love what ur doin!

  52. Posted by Stephen on January 31, 2013 at 8:01 PM

    Right on so, after I do an extraction i can Decarbox… It to clean it then make edibles from the already extracted herb

    • Yes, and if you do it at 250F, any residual butane trapped in the oil will be purged along with decarboxylation.

      • Posted by Stephen on January 31, 2013 at 9:37 PM

        yea i vac purge my oil, but i was seeing instead of throwing all my herb away after iv ran it, is there any other uses for it?

        • Depends on how effectively you remove the oil with the butane. We typically don’t re-run material that we’ve extracted using butane, because we’ve pretty much gotten it all.

          You can examine your material with a microscope, and if you have many intact heads, it might be worthwhile. Ignore the stems and hairs, as they are left behind after extraction.

  53. Posted by Jizbert on January 30, 2013 at 12:32 PM

    Your method and probably any method turns vapo poo into a sickening result that doesn’t do a thing where a high is concerned. If it takes more than a tea spoon I would puke.

    • While glycerin tincture from fresh bud doesn’t produce much euphoric head effects, from once vaped remains, there is more like a charley horse between the ears, than a euphoric high. It is highly sedative.

  54. Posted by Stephen on January 25, 2013 at 3:09 AM

    this is awesome! brings to mind… iv been saving my material from my last few bho runs, is there anyway to use it other than rerunngin it, was hoping for some edibles, is that bad?

  55. Posted by Jizbert on January 22, 2013 at 10:46 AM

    Why not cook the glycerin in a stainless steel pot rather than put a glass jar in an oil bath in a stainless steel pot ?

  56. Posted by Alison on January 22, 2013 at 8:17 AM

    I was also wondering why you use oil and not water for your heat method. I think I can achieve those temps with water, in my small electric crock pot if I start with boiling water.

    • I use oil because I have an oil pot standing by for general alchemy, some of which is above 100C/212F.

      I prefer using oil to heat, because it doesn’t evaporate away and require periodic replenishment. It also doesn’t add water vapor to hygroscopic solutions like alcohol and glycerin.

      You can use hot water for glycerin extraction and we do use hot water for oil and ghee extractions. None of them are hygroscopic and we do it in a closed container.

      GW

  57. Posted by Alison on January 22, 2013 at 8:12 AM

    Great article and discussion. Now I’m wondering about using the hot method, and then putting my solids in alcohol to dissolve remaining good stuff. I’d combine the alcohol and glycerin extracts for dosing – I prefer the flavor and balance. Will I still get anything out of the used solids this way?

    • Yes, glycerin leaves a lot behind, even with the hot method. I can usually get three extractions out of a batch of material using the hot method.

      If it is flavor that you seek, you might try a quick wash of the frozen material first, and then do a cold glycerin extraction. Long soaks with alcohol will add an all permeating greeeeen flavor, due to the chlorophyll that readily dissolves in it.

  58. Posted by Bobby on January 1, 2013 at 8:27 AM

    Hello… I have been trying to make a tincture to use in my E-cig as well. Sorry if this is irrelevant but I used kief instead of green buds. I mixed 2g of fluffy kief with 20ml of 50/50 PG/VG. I pre heated the PG/VG and then slowly added the kief on top. I allowed to sit in a double boiler for 6 total hours with periodic swirling of the jar. The kief did not dissolve as I expected. It is now sitting in my drawer for the required 3 weeks. About three days in, I took a little from the top (the kief had settled) with a syringe and squirted it into my pen… no buzz felt :(. I did however get a nice buzz when I put a little under my tongue and inside my cheeks. But I made it so I can refill my pen… did I do something wrong? Please advise! Happy New Year!!!!!

    • We haven’t tried Propylene Glycol, but have observed that Vegetable Glycerin dissolves cannabis essential oils slowly and is more limited in how much it will hold in solution than alcohol. I would recommend heat cycling it at 180F and stirring it regularly, rather than swirling the jar. You need to keep the boundary layers removed by mechanical action.

      • Posted by Bobby on January 2, 2013 at 8:07 AM

        So I should reheat? I don’t know why i used PG… I guess I read way too many recipes online and got mixed up. I mainly used the infamous “BadKittysmiles” recipe and hers says if you heat more than 6 hours you will reduce potency. I’ve already heated for 6 hours so should I do another 6? I realized the 3day old tincture in my pen does actually give a slight buzz… I guess it just needs time mostly. How many times would you recommend heat cycling? Shoudl I expect most of the kief to dissolve?

        Thank you for your expertise!!

        • Doing it differently next time is easier than fixing what you have at this point. If you heat it up and stir it heavily, you can pick up as much resin as it is going to, but it will also make it more sedative. A choice………..

          Another way might be to filter out the kif and put it in a smaller amount of fresh glycerin and cycle and stir it vigorously. I have never gotten all the resin to dissolve with only one glycerin bath.

          As far as fully dissolving, it won’t ever. A trichome contains cellulose stalks and sheathing, which will be left behind.

  59. Posted by John Jones on December 30, 2012 at 1:15 PM

    Hi Happy new Year to everyone.

    Glad the site is going from strength to strength.

    I have two jars of glycerin tincture not decarboxylated.
    As a non cooking male a 250 f oil in a pan is a little frightening.

    I am sending for a cooking thermometer

    We have a deep fat fryer that goes up to 190 f

    Will that do a full decarboxylate?

    best wishes

    • 190C or F? Deep fryers typically go to about 190C/375F.

      You can decarboxylate at 190F, but it will be highly sedative. Check out the heat temperature curves at http://skunkpharmresearch.com/decarboxylation/.

      Deep fryers also typically don’t have precise low dead band controls in the 250F temperature range, as they aren’t needed. We use electric fondue pots, which are used for delicate sauces, and do have good controls.

      You can use a stove top, but it will typically have a wide dead band and requires close monitoring with a good thermometer and often fiddling with the controls.

  60. Posted by Ecigin on December 22, 2012 at 3:33 PM

    I tried this w avb, works great. Now Im ready to try the hot extract method

  61. Posted by Mr F on December 19, 2012 at 12:40 AM

    Hi GW

    I don’t know if you are familiar with e cigarettes or not but you can use them to vaporize extracts with no harmful effects to the user. The common carriers for ecigs nicotine are propylene glycol and vegetable glycerin.

    I realize that your research of potency has been anecdotal; but if you had to guess, what percentage THC would you think the various extracts are and which could be the most potent.

    Which method would you recommend for vaporization?

    Thank you for any insight you might have.

    • Judging from tests by others, I would estimate THC in the range of 80 to 90% from absolute amber from the right strain. A non polar extraction that has been winterized, would ostensibly have less non actives than a polar extraction.

      For me personally, most potent is not necessarly the best criteria for vaporization. I prefer a potent extraction with good flavor and both fresh frozen BHO extract and Quick Wash ethanol extractions of cured material, will provide both potency and flavor.

      • Posted by Mr F on December 19, 2012 at 9:30 PM

        I realize that you believe that butane is safe, I however do not. I don’t really want to debate the issue. That is why SCFE and glycerin extraction are both so intriguing to me.

        Do you believe that glycerin extraction would vaporize in much the same way that an ecig would?

        The reason I ask about potency is maybe I misunderstood your paper and it sounded like it was 30% THC.

        I appreciate you as a unique resource and any help you can provide.

        • We used a glycerin extract in e-cigs, but could never get the potency that we can using straight absolute amber.

          The 30% was the percent cannabis essential oils glycerin is capable of dissolving, vis a vis alcohol.

          • Posted by korupt on December 2, 2013 at 4:55 AM

            Do you happen to know how much THC PG can dissolve? Seems that pretty much everywhere I read that it dissolves a lot better than VG.

            Thinking that you could get a decent strength e-juice if you mix the two.

            Best regards
            k

          • PG works a lot better than VG and many folks do mix the two, to get both a decent concentration and the flavor and vapor characteristics of VG.

    • Posted by Ecigin on December 22, 2012 at 3:37 PM

      I’ve done tried this w a homemade ecig and works so nice… Especialy if you add the ecig watermelon flavoring extract. The flavoring also thins it out a bit for a nice vape.

  62. Posted by Sam on November 11, 2012 at 8:39 PM

    Great info. Thanks! One question: Did the author run any real qualitative analysis on the resulting tinctures and pressed plant material after various hot and cold methods were employed or are users personal feedback the only analysis that’s been completed? In other words, does anyone know exactly the percent thc, other cannibinoids and other compounds from the plant that can be expected in these tinctures after say one cycle of the cold method, then two cycles or more or after one cycle of the hot method? And is any thc and/or other desirable cannabinoids left in the plant material and, if so, how much?

    • No GC tests were run and evaluation was by volunteer patient test panel. We are working on bringing our new used GC on line, as we speak and relative glycerin potency is on our list.

      Anecdotically, it reaches maybe a third of the potency achievable with a reduceable solvent.

  63. Posted by honeypie on November 9, 2012 at 11:42 AM

    hi greywolf and co. can you please clarify how you would decarboxilize a cold press after the soaking and straining. does the co2 ‘bubble out’ using the same temps as you detailed with alcohol extraction, or does glycerin need to be treated differently.

    • Most folks who do cold extraction, either decarboxylate the plant material up front, or let it decarboxylate naturally over time, as they are after flavor retention.

      If you do decarboxylate the glycerin tonic afterwards, I would use the same 250F oil bath and watch the bubbles. The water will come off first, and then the CO2.

      Decarboxylation needs to stay under 170C/338F, the flash point of glycerin.

  64. Posted by Trip Fontain on August 6, 2012 at 10:44 AM

    Excellent information. I have been looking for awhile insearch of such a thorough tutorial on this subject. I myself have been highly interested in the extract/tincture subject and have been waiting for detailed information such as this to read ad learn from. Thank you! Great read!

  65. Posted by AAron on July 20, 2012 at 4:50 PM

    I did a hot extraction method just like this a while ago, and had it sitting in my cupboard in mason jars. We had used bubble hash bags to filter the glycerin from the plant material, but there was still sediment which gathered at the bottom of the jars. After a couple weeks, the sediment was relatively solid and could be scraped off the bottom. I looked at the sediment under a microscope and it’s 100% trichome heads, unbroken apparently.

    Long story short, I poured off the liquid and mixed the thick oily solids back into the remaining little bit of glycerin. I now have an extract that is very thick, and leaves trichomes on the sides of the glass. It is also very potent. Three normal sized mason jars only produced about 10 teaspoons of this super extract. I am certain the glycerin is well beyond the 30% saturation point for these trichomes are remaining completely undissolved.

    Have you ever experimented with the sediment after a process?

    • Not in the same way you have, but you certainly make it sound interesting!

      Because we filter at around 74 microns, using a hydraulic press, not many intact trichomes make it through into the filtrate.

      What we do instead to capture those un-dissolved trichomes , is reprocess the cake a second and third time to extract the material that wasn’t fully dissolved the first pass.

      What micron bag size did you use?

      • Posted by AAron on July 21, 2012 at 3:08 PM

        Since we were experimenting, we used different size micron bags. The first batch we did used the 45 micron bag. The resulting glycerin was honey-colored and had almost none of the aforementioned sediment. The second batch we did used I believe the 140 micron bag, and that is the batch which gave us the settling residue.

        The only issue with this concentrate is that it likes to settle back into a solid. I have 3 teaspoons in a little eye dropper jar and already the bottom eight of an inch on the jar is returned to solid. It would be very difficult to keep this in a liquid state for much longer than a couple hours before it tries to separate again.

        We didn’t use a press or anything, just squeezed the glycerin through the bag by hand.

        • 140 micron is larger than most mature trichome heads, so I’m thinking that therein lies the critical parameter in reproducing your filtration results.

          It also points out that even with hot processing, that it takes more than one extraction to dissolve all the resins available.

          Thanks for sharing bro AA! Sounds like an opportunity for more research! Hee, hee, hee…………

      • Posted by Myles on January 17, 2013 at 7:44 AM

        Ok if I were to follow the hot extraction method and cook it at a 180F. For 7 intervals of 30 mn. Would it be fully decarboxylate? Or would I have to put it in a 250F oil bath for another 30 mn? I Would be ingesting this not smoking.
        Thanks, I love your work and I really appreceit what your doing.

        • It will be decarboxylated and ready to use as is.

          • Posted by Myles on January 19, 2013 at 8:42 PM

            My bad it posted. Buy any way
            1. Soak broken up bud in isoproplyn alchol for 30 mn.
            2. Filter bud
            3. Evaporate iso alchol to a workable amount.
            4. Add iso alchol oil solution to sep. Funnle.
            5. Add a equal amount of HEPTANE.
            6. swirl/shake around.
            7. Add a saturated solution of salt water. Let sit.
            8. recover heptane solution.
            9. let heptane evaporate
            10. heat at 250F in a copper bb bath for 30 mn or untill no more bubbles.
            11. Add hash oil to glycerin and enjoy :)

            My only worry is the high boiling point of heptane (206F) so its kinda hard to remove. But I would think the 250F bath would remove almost all of the heptane. I was thinking about just doing a QWISO. I’m using heptane as a opposed to hexane-simply because it is
            more readily avalible to me, and I’m not a fan of butane.

          • A couple of thoughts:

            Due to its longer molecule chain and the resultant higher Van der Waal forces, Heptane is even harder to completely remove than Hexane, so you probably will need a few alcohol washes, and/or vacuum purging.

            As counter intuitive as it sounds, we’ve had zip for luck getting an oil concentrate to dissolve in vegetable glycerin. It appears to not dissolve a bunch of things that other solvents do.

            It partially dissolves and leaves floaters of undissolved material, which is close to the same specific gravity and can’t be filtered out, without dropping the temperature to below freezing, and not very well then. For what ever reason, they taste like hammered crap, destroying the otherwise delightful glycerin tincture flavors.

            Dissolving the oil in ethanol, mixing it with the glycerin, and then boiling off the alcohol was offered as a solution, but alas we got separation when we tried that too. If you do come up with a good way to mix glycerin and cannabis oil concentrates, I hope you will share!

            GW

  66. Posted by FaroutMan on July 11, 2012 at 8:19 PM

    I have read in some recipes that the saturation level of oils can be increased by using some alcohol near the end of the cooking process. I wonder if the same technique could be applied to the hot glycerin extraction process.

    Any idea what kind of dosage levels can be reached with the hot extraction method? How does the potency compare to something vegan like coconut oil?

    • Adding some polar solvent, to an otherwise non polar extraction, will do a faster extraction of the polar carboxylic acid constitutes. Glycerin is already polar, so any benefits should be minimal.

      Glycerin extracts are typically about a third as saturated as an alcohol tincture that hasn’t been reduced to increase potency. I used a dropper full, vis a vis three drops of alcohol tincture.

  67. Posted by desiderata319 on June 3, 2012 at 8:52 AM

    Ingenious press! Much more tangible than buying a press for a few hundred bucks. TY

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